So.... I'm Adopted Podcast!
This podcast creates a space for genuine conversations about adoption, where emotions are acknowledged, journeys are reconciled, and a healthy acceptance of truths is fostered. Delve into the impact of adoption on all parties involved, gaining insights from adoptees, adoptive parents, biological parents, as well as professional psychologists and social workers. Explore the realities, reconciliation processes, and ongoing dynamics of adoption.
So.... I'm Adopted Podcast!
Beyond Blood: How An Open Adoption Shaped Who I Am
What happens when an adoptee grows up in an open adoption during the 1990s and becomes a children's book author? Sasha Sedman takes us through her remarkable journey, revealing the beautiful complexity of relationships that form when adoption is treated with honesty from the beginning.
Sasha shares the extraordinary story of her birth - how her adoptive mother became friends with her birth mother during pregnancy and was even present in the delivery room. From a wicker bassinet rescued from an alley to Raggedy Ann dolls that connect generations, the physical objects of Sasha's adoption story symbolize the thoughtful ways her families remained connected throughout her life.
The conversation explores the nuanced dynamics between adoptive and birth families, particularly the different comfort levels each person brings to these relationships. Sasha recounts meeting her paternal biological family in her twenties and discovering shared physical traits she'd never experienced before. She articulates the delicate balance of boundaries, explaining how her adoptive parents empowered her with freedom of choice while preparing her for the realities that birth family members might also have their own boundaries.
Most powerfully, Sasha reveals how her adoption experience directly influences her work as a children's author. Her book "First Day: An Adoption Story" provides families with a universal adoption narrative and space to document their unique stories. She also discusses "All Out of Ducks," her humor-filled book about parental exhaustion that incorporates critical maternal mental health resources she wishes she'd had during her own postpartum depression.
The episode culminates with Sasha's wisdom on normalizing diverse family structures and validating the complex emotions that accompany adoption. As she puts it, "Any feelings you have are valid, and any feelings other people have are valid" - a perspective that creates space for honest conversations and deeper connections in all types of families.
Ready to explore the world of open adoption through a storyteller's eyes? Listen now and discover how one author is helping families write their own narratives of belonging.
Music by Curtis Rodgers IG @itsjustcurtis
Produce and Edited by Lisa Sapp
Executive Producer Lisa Sapp
Executive Producer Johnnie Underwood
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Welcome to the so I'm Adopted podcast, where we talk everything adoption. This journey is not one we take alone. Together, we grapple with raw emotions that surface from adoption stories. We want you to be comfortable enough to heal, so sit back and go with us on this journey as we dive deep into adoption. Welcome to another episode of so I'm Adopted. I'm John.
Speaker 2:And I'm Lisa.
Speaker 1:And we are.
Speaker 2:Adopted.
Speaker 1:And again, this is an opportunity and a space where we wanted to create an opportunity for individuals to have this safe, where we can talk about non-traditional relationships. As always, I give credit where credit is due about non-traditional relationships. As always, I give credit where credit is due. Lisa was very consistent and persistent about us being able to tell our stories and I think, based on the feedback that we have gotten, it has been a jewel because we've connected with some amazing individuals.
Speaker 1:We've learned that you know we're not the only ones and a lot of times I can't speak for that. I won't generalize it. I know, for me, I felt like my journey was an isolated one, like I was the only one that had ever been on or driven past this island, and what we've learned is that there are so many layers to being adopted in that whole ordeal. It's like an onion. There's lots of layers to it. Lots of layers to it, absolutely. And I'll be honest, we had a sneak peek at our guests for tonight and it was mind-blowing. I'm going to tell you right now. So I'm definitely excited. We've connected with some amazing individuals.
Speaker 2:We have, and this one is a different angle that we haven't had the opportunity to have on the show. So I'm excited. I'm very excited about this one.
Speaker 1:So, let's, let's jump in, please. Before we jump in, we want to thank you for investing the time. Hit the like. Hit the share button. Hit the like. Hit the share button. If you have a adoption story, if you have a non-traditional relationship, family dynamic story, please reach out to us. We are open to the different discussions, because what we're learning is that the platforms are out there, but we don't know how to connect the dots, and that's one of the things that we want to do. We've learned about a conference, that that they have a working group of adoptees that are out there, so we just want this to be fruitful for you. So, lisa, let's go jump in.
Speaker 2:All right, let's let's introduce our guest for today. Sasha Sedman is a cherished voice children's literature, weaving tales of wonder and wisdom. From her home in the vibrant heart of Washington DC area, alongside her devoted husband and their two delightful children, sasha crafts stories that celebrate the diverse tapestry of families, drawing from her own unique journey through life. Adopted into a loving family through an open adoption, sasha's early experiences has imbued her with a deep appreciation for the myriad ways families come together, a theme that radiates through her enchanting narratives. Despite facing the challenges of dyslexia, which made the written words a formidable puzzle in her youth, sasha, her indubitably spirit, saw her transcend these early obstacles. Her journey from a high school dropout to a GED achiever stands as a testament to her resilience and determination, quality that has guided her path to become a beloved children's author.
Speaker 2:Sasha Works is more than just storytelling. It's an invitation to embrace life's adventures and to find the joy in every moment. To embrace life's adventures and to find the joy in every moment Her personal mantra to change what doesn't bring joy infuses her writing with a infectious optimism that encourages young readers to seek happiness and fulfillment in their pursuits in their pursuits. So we want to welcome Ms Sasha Sedman to our podcast today and let me go ahead and get her on in so you guys can meet her as well. Hello, ms Sasha.
Speaker 3:Hi, how are you guys doing?
Speaker 1:Good. How are you doing?
Speaker 3:I'm good. Hopefully no more snow, no more being snowed in.
Speaker 1:Listen, I'm back in Florida.
Speaker 3:It is 84 degrees so y'all can have that. It's about 60 here, so it's not too bad, we're getting there, we're getting there, we're catching up.
Speaker 2:There you go, we are, I'm jealous.
Speaker 1:So I'm going to tell you right now, even after we had our conversation a week and a half ago and then hearing the bio, I'm just that much more excited about the discussion. Just, I learned a few other things that you didn't share with us, that you gave in the bio. So the way we normally start off, it's a very organic conversation Tell us your story and, because we have not discussed the open adoption, so make sure that you educate those who may not about I recently spoke in an adoption conference two weeks ago with my mom.
Speaker 3:And what I had is now considered a typical nineties open adoption, and that basically meant that my family had contact within reason. So there were. I'll go back to the start of the story and then kind of describe it as we go. But I, um, my parents, were looking to adopt through China and they said there was a five-year waiting list. So they said, reach out to everyone you know, um, and just tell them you and your husband are looking for a baby. And that's what they did.
Speaker 3:Uh, and it turned out that my mom and when I say mom, or real mom, that's my mom and birth mom is just for, but my mom had an aunt or cousin and she said, hey, I have this friend down in Florida who's seven months pregnant with a girl looking for an open adoption.
Speaker 3:So my parents got on a flight and they met my birth mother and my birth sister, who was 16 at the time, at an olive garden my birth mother and my birth sister, who was 16 at the time, at an olive garden and they chatted and they spoke about expectations and what relationships would look like.
Speaker 3:And my mom said they went back to the hotel that night and said I want that baby and they had lawyers and they decided that they wanted an open adoption, that that's something they wanted for me and to give me. And so for my birth mother's last two weeks of pregnancy, my mom actually spent them with her, taking her to and from appointments, going to the beach, going to bars and restaurants, hanging out, and the way she recently described it is they just became friends and she was actually the support person in the room when my birth mother gave birth to me. And she was actually the support person in the room when my birth mother gave birth to me. And the way it was told is that a nurse swaddled me and then handed me to my birth mother and she pushed me away and said give her to her mom.
Speaker 3:My mom was the first to hold me and that will always just be, I'm sure, like she said. The way she describes it now, which I love wholeheartedly, especially being a mom myself, is, she said I looked at you into those blue eyes and I had the dumbest thought in the world I could never be mad at you. She said the naivety of a new parent. She said it was just everything all at once. They stayed in a long stay Marriott for three or four weeks until all the paperwork went through. My birth mother previously had thought she was going to keep me with my birth father, but they split up halfway through the pregnancy and she already had a daughter with another man and she was about to go off to college. And my understanding is my birth mother knew how hard it was, Even now, at the age of 35, having a baby. She knew that she wasn't ready and she just could not handle it on her own, along with life and a 16 year old, financially, emotionally. And so she gave me the gift of parents that really wanted that and wanted that life and to nurture me. And so she told my parents that she had a bassinet that she had found in an alley and fixed up and she's a seamstress. So my parents bought a car to fit this enormous wicker bassinet into the back of it so they could drive home with it and I'm happy to say now both my children have slept in it. It has been kept for the past 32 years as a stuffed animal holder, as a memento holder, and it's now in my office with my stuffed animals and for the first year and a half to two years my birth mother would send letters and my mom would send pictures and it was all direct and a lot of the time with open adoptions are through the agency. So you would send pictures through the agency. They would send it to the birth family. So you don't really know their address but you have that contact.
Speaker 3:When I was about two my birth mother wrote and said I would love to meet Sasha and my parents flew me down to Florida and my mom said she had this fear kind of build up inside of her that I was going to have some cosmic connection with my birth mother. When I saw her and my two-year-old self would run into her arms and just have this immediate mother-daughter connection and she was scared. But she knew that she had wanted an open adoption and you know she had done all the research and at that point it had said that that is ideal for a child, so they can have questions answered if possible. And we got to the airport and my mom said we saw my birth mother. And I walked right behind her and stuck my head out between her legs and she said it was the most fulfilling, grounding moment of motherhood, where she was like you do that with every other person you've ever met and she was like I'm your mom and she's like, from then on it was like we can see Linda, we can call her, we can hang out, we can do whatever we need to, but I'm your mom and that's your birth mom.
Speaker 3:And we went on like that where, whenever I would, it wasn't really scheduled, it was just send letters and pictures. If we're going on a vacation, we invite my birth mom, we invite my birth father, we invite my sister, and it just was normal where they were. This extended family that you know, sent gifts around Christmas and my birthday and it was beautiful. And when I was 11, I, my mom, said what do you want for your birthday? And I said I want to go see Linda. And so we flew down and I spent a day with her sewing a little Barbie dress and I was a bridesmaid in my sister's first wedding in Vegas. Oh wow, and it was great. But that's really the last time I saw her, which is crazy, because I have contact with her even now. We text message regularly, text message regularly.
Speaker 3:But she, while we were on that trip to Vegas, someone approached me and my mom because they didn't recognize us from the family and said so who are you? And my mom said my birth mother looked at her and she it was me and my sister, and then my birth mother and my mom and she said we are their mothers and they are our daughters. And my mom said that was just so classy, it was just so perfectly said. And from then on it was just, you know, mother's day, you know, do you want to do you want to call your, your mom, your birth mother? You know when we'd call, she would talk about me as their daughter. Our daughter is so beautiful, our daughter is doing, and it was just such an openness that I never had a worry about talking to my mom about my birth family. And of course there's problems in every family. Every family is complicated. Every teenage years are complicated for every single person I've ever met. So I don't think that's special to adoption, but we definitely had our ups and downs as a family.
Speaker 3:But even to this day I have told them when I'm pregnant, I've told them when I'm expecting what I'm expecting, and my birth mother when I was a baby, she sent me some Raggedy Ann dolls to go with my bassinet, and recently she sent my children some Raggedy Ann dolls and it's this like full circle moment where she just finds these things. And I found out that before I was meant to be adopted my name was supposed to be Rose and my name is Sasha Marilyn after my name. And then my mom. Her mother was named Marilyn and I was actually born on her birthday, which was always our little meant to be moment. It was not the due date that was apparent, but when I had my daughter I decided to name her after Rose and Rose's first name was Esteline. So my daughter is named Estelle after my biological great-grandmother, to honor that and to bring in my birth family.
Speaker 3:And I've heard great things about her and her strength as a woman and I just want to continue this openness with my own children, even though they're biological. I think it's important to keep conversations about families that look different, families that are different, families that might look the same on the outside. I was adopted by two white parents and I had blonde hair, blue eyes and so, unless I brought it up, people just assumed I had slightly older parents. And you know some, sometimes, you know people would say things like oh, adoption, you know, oh yeah, they just throw their kid out and it's like I'm adopted.
Speaker 3:Don't see it that way, let's have a conversation about it Right, change the dialogue. Or when people say, do you know your real parents? Those are my parents. I know my biological family, I know my birth family, and I guess the only other thing I'll say is I think it's funny because my husband was actually adopted by his father. I'll say is I think it's funny because my husband was actually adopted by his father.
Speaker 3:And so he has a really cool dynamic there where he had a very different experience with adoption, where he wasn't told until he was 12 that his father was not his biological father and he never had a chance to meet his biological father because he passed before he ever found him. And so we often talk about like the difference between really knowing everything I know and being able to text these people and say my kid has a penicillin allergy. Does that run in the family? Is that something you know? Oh, they had a reaction to this. Oh, my thyroid's going crazy. You know what's going on here and you know he has part of the opportunity to do that, but he also, you know, never got to speak to his biological father. So I think it's interesting because I think in my case I had a really ideal open adoption where everyone was open to it. But my parents also prepared me from very early on and they also kind of armored me with the ability of like my freedom of choice. So if I ever didn't feel comfortable with something, if I needed to put a boundary up, I had that right and they would support it. But they also acknowledged that my birth family and anyone for that matter, had the ability to put up their own boundaries.
Speaker 3:And so I, you know, invited my birth family to my wedding and I hadn't seen them in many years and I would have loved for them to be there. And my birth mother very sweetly basically said she doesn't, she doesn't think they can come, and she gave whatever. I forget what the excuse was, but me and my mom talked about it and we said well, we haven't seen her since I was 13. This is 150 people. She may not want to answer those questions. She may not be comfortable seeing you for the first time in so long at such a huge event. And also, I'm not a birth. I'm not a birth mother who gave up a child, so I don't know those mixed emotions that she may have. But what I loved is that.
Speaker 3:I then asked. I said, can you make my wedding veil? And so she made the veil for my wedding and I got to wear it and my birth sister came with my niece and I got to meet my niece during that trip Um, it was seven at the time so I had them and I had them walk and honor that side of the family and I had my birth mother's veil and it was really special. But I know people who have invited birth family to large events and they were really hurt by them not coming and I think that my parents really prepared me and that I had a relationship from day one where I didn't idealize them and I didn't fairy tale my biological family, and that was really important to how I look at them now where they're people and they have emotions and they have boundaries and they have things that they're comfortable with and things they're uncomfortable with, and that's anyone.
Speaker 3:And so I think, when dealing with adoption, you just have to go in knowing that there's going to be times that you might set boundaries, there might be times they might set boundaries, and that's family, that's our family, and it's okay to do that and it's okay to happen, it's okay to have all the feelings about it. It's just, you know, if you want to open that door, you can, and you have to be aware that someone might not open that door. I rarely hear from my birth father right now, but I hear from my birth mother more. I hear from my birth cousins on my birth father's side more, and that's okay. And I know you know he is proud and I know she's proud.
Speaker 3:She has all of my books and I'm so excited to always share them with her, and I wrote one about adoption and I wanted to preserve her privacy. So all I did was put a little raggedy and all in one of the illustrations to put that in. And I had a friend who was also adopted and his family sent me a little elephant when my son was born. So I put the little elephant in there too to itemize him and his journey with adoption and his life. So but yeah, that's my adoption story and, I guess, my thoughts right off the bat on adoption. Sorry if I went on for a little bit guess my thoughts right off the bat on adoption.
Speaker 1:Sorry if I went on for a little bit, that's perfectly fine. So the first thing that I will say you know, you, the benefit of, like you said, that dialogue, that truth that your mom was able to have with you from the beginning, you know that to me helped your journey, because I think what happens and again I'm speaking from a place where I always knew I was adopted, but I didn't get the pieces to put the puzzle together until I was over 40 plus years old but, having that emotional intelligence so early, I think really, and just in listening to you, it's healthy. It's healthy and you, you, they were very proactive in that react.
Speaker 3:They were, and I, you know I love writing children's books, and something that inspired me was my parents read me a book called tell me again about the night I was born, and it was about two white parents flying over and picking up a white baby from a hospital. And that was my story. But I, very early on, was introduced to this idea of adoption, before I could even understand what it was. It was just a common factor in the books I was read and the things that were told. You know, when I would ask about being in mommy's tummy, she'd say, oh no, you're in her tummy, okay. And so when I wrote my adoption book, something that I tried to do was to make it more universal. Where we don't have a mom or a dad, we don't have a race or a gender or an age, and so even on the cover, if you can see it, it's all of these different little faces that, throughout the book, the child can see and pick themselves out on the front and the back, to make it more universal. Because I think that that is a beautiful thing about adoption is that it is universal and it can happen at any age and there can be so many different situations. Like you said, you didn't know all the pieces until you were in your forties. And that's similarly to my husband, where it's just and you're still putting them together. I'm sure it's figuring those things out, trying to figure out what people were doing. And, yeah, that open dialogue I think really helped.
Speaker 3:And I will say my dad is a little bit more threatened by a relationship with my birth father where he has two biological children from a previous marriage where he's dad and then he adopted me and I think that he has some feelings about wanting to be my only dad, which he's my dad and I have a biological father.
Speaker 3:But even that relationship and me being raised in such an open environment, I still can't be honest and talk to him about it. The same way I talked to my mom, just because of the way she approached things, where everything was so open, where there was never a feeling of me feeling like I couldn't ask a question or I felt like I had to make a choice or I'd hurt someone's feelings, which I think is like really typical. Because you know, I think it's hard I assume it's hard as an adoptive parent to feel connected to your child, sometimes to feel like you're really their parent, and so I understand his hesitancy towards my beginning of the open adoption was your biological father involved in that part of it, or it was really the, the mothers yeah.
Speaker 3:So my understanding is that they were going to keep me. My birth mother moved in with him and she said three days later he looked at her and it was the same look that her ex-husband gave before he left, and so she packed up her stuff and moved back to where she was and said I'm putting the baby up for adoption. My parents told me that when they were signing the adoption papers, my birth mother basically had everything signed, sealed, delivered before birth, where she was, like you know, the second the baby's here, yours and my birth father did not want to sign and initially the worry was that he was going to back out of it, that he would want to raise me, but what they later found out is he just wanted to hold me. He was worried that they were just going to take me and that he'd never have a chance to meet me. Well, did he have that opportunity? He did, and I have pictures in the hospital and the motel, um, you know, spending those three or four weeks in Florida prior to me leaving. They really connected and shared moments together and there's like a lot of pictures from that time which I really cherish.
Speaker 3:Um and he signed, and he actually later on, when I was 18, um requested a DNA test from me. Uh, he said he's not sure he's my birth father, that that's why he had been more distant during my childhood. He had visited, but not as much, and I had never met his extended family and that was the reason is they had concerns. Uh, I brought it up to my family, I brought it up to my birth mother. My birth mother, you know, rolled her eyes and said he's your birth father, like, and my parents said, yes, he asked for a DNA test at birth. That was a blood test and they thought it was too invasive. So they made the decision, as my guardian, to say no, I ended up doing a cheek swab. It came back, he was my biological father and he immediately sent me this long email about going to Alabama, meeting my family, meeting his mother, meeting his siblings. He had two brothers and a sister and everyone wanted to meet me with open arms and I was 18, going through a lot, and I ended up waiting until I was 22 years old and I was moving to Arizona, and so I ended up driving through North Carolina, alabama, and so I ended up meeting his sister, her extended family, my only living grandmother who's still alive and seeing him and his girlfriend and his family, and it was awesome and it was like it was almost surreal because I just had never met them but we had so much in common and really weird ways.
Speaker 3:He asked me if my toe was weird and it was like it was almost surreal because I just had never met them, but we had so much in common in really weird ways. He asked me if my toe was weird and it was a really strange question because I don't have any biological features of my parents, so it's not something people normally are like oh, you have their eyes, you have this. And I said, yeah, my toes. You know, I don't have a baby toenail. And he goes oh, you get that from my mom. It was like this really kind of unreal moment and now that I have kids I can see myself in them. But I'm like it's really strange, like I've never really had a family member that looks like me, like right, like I've never been like oh, I have your hair, we have each other's ears, you know. But it was cool to have those conversations kind of for the first time in a really large setting.
Speaker 2:So was there a reason why getting a DNA test done took so long after the original ask, when you were first born?
Speaker 3:My assumption, and from my understanding, is that my birth father basically felt shut down by my parents when he initially asked. So his thinking was I'm just going to wait until she's an adult and she can make her decision. So I don't know if it was going around my parents and he felt like he couldn't ask them or if it just was a moment of you know, maybe it's time, but he definitely had every opportunity to ask. But I think the way my mom had put it to him was when Sasha's old enough, she can make the decision. And so I think for him that was legal age to make a decision, versus me being 11 or 12, where he really didn't know if my parents would have been open to allowing it, even if I had accepted. So I think that was just in his opinion. You know, she's an adult, she can make the decision. No one's going to make it for her and I can have that peace of mind that it's not being made for her. So go ahead.
Speaker 2:I can understand that to a certain degree. But then he lost so many years with getting to know you and you getting to know his family Well, your family you know. So that's unfortunate that he felt that he wasn't able to approach. I guess he didn't, you know, he didn't want to get hurt, I guess, because I'm sure he hurt when they told him no at the beginning. So I'm sure that was devastating to him.
Speaker 3:He's a very private person and he's never been married, he's never had other children, he lives alone. He has a long-term girlfriend who he has a lot of affection for. She has grandchildren, but he still lives separate. So my understanding is that he's just kind of who he is and he likes his life the way he likes his life. So I think between him being a very private person and just kind of non-confrontational, he's just kind of took a step back and was like okay, I'm not her dad, I'm her biological father and I'm here but I'm at a distance.
Speaker 3:And I actually experienced that when I first had my son three years ago. I had told him and he was very excited for me and I let him know it was a boy and he doesn't have any biological children other than me, so this would be his first male biological descendant and so that was really cool for him. But we didn't talk a whole lot but one of his, one of my cousins, his sister's daughter, reached out and we chatted a little bit and she goes, just so you know, he carries around a picture of Deegan and he shows us and that was really special and it was also one of those moments where you realize there was a boundary of he may not be comfortable talking to me about it, but he's comfortable talking to his people about it and it was special to be able to hear that and to get a little glimpse of that and I think it also gave me a little peace of mind where it's like, okay, even if he's not going to reply to my texts or he's not, you know, he is proud, he does love, he has his love. But sometimes it's just, I don't know all these emotions of how he feels or what he goes through when he sees this life that I've built.
Speaker 3:And you know, my dad visits and my mom visit and they're the grandparents, or grandma and grandpa visits, and my mom visit and they're the grandparents, or grandma and grandpa, you know, and they know them from a distance but they've never met my kids. So they, you know, might feel a certain way about that. And also he's a little bit more old school, so he's a little bit more blood is blood and his family, I don't think, fully supported the adoption but he also was not ready to be a single parent. So I think there might've been some feelings around my birth mother deciding to give me up, that she made the decision, he went with it and they weren't as supportive of it. So I love all of them, but I do think that that played into it.
Speaker 1:Right what I was going to say earlier. Going back to your father and, like you said, him being threatened, and I immediately thought about with my daughters, as a dad, a girl dad you know that connection and you know I said, well, how would I feel? And it would be a rough period because, normally and not normally Again, my situation. My mom had the threat of the file is closed, you can't open it, whereas my dad was like I want to know too, let's go so to hear that it was the opposite way for you. You know it's interesting, but it's something about, you know, dads and girls that just have a different connection.
Speaker 3:Oh, yeah, my husband and our daughter. That is his little princess. She could commit every felony in the book and he just where do I bury the bodies, honey? She's only two, so she's not committing any crimes yet.
Speaker 1:but yeah, yeah, it's interesting. I remember with my first daughter that was the first blood relative that I met, that I held, and it just it did something for me. It was like the Lion King moment, where you hold up the baby. And I remember telling her that story and I didn't know that she is very proud of that, like she wears that as a badge of honor. We were talking and my youngest was like yes, she always tells us you're the first blood relative that she met. And I said you feel some kind of way about that. Well, because she tells me like every month and in that moment I was like wow that's.
Speaker 1:That's awesome, you know, because now there's a shared moment, and so, again, I'm getting more sentimental in my older age. We went to SeaWorld today and they have a sesame place In Williamsburg. They have a sesame place as well, so they have some of the same rides, but they have this whirly worm, and I don't do roller coasters, but when I saw the whirly worm, I had to get on it. And Jayla was like dad, you getting on it? And I said let me tell you why I'm getting on it. And it was her and Jordan. And I said the reason I'm getting on it. I said because in 2013,. We were on this ride in Williamsburg and I got the call that my mom had had a stroke. I said and that's when she got ready to transition. I said so this is me taking you on that ride, cause we never went back. And both of them were like I remember that, you know. So it was a good moment. And then, once we got on, I was like why am I on this thing? I'm going to throw up, yeah.
Speaker 3:Sometimes we feel a certain way.
Speaker 1:Right, right, I got emotionally drawn in, but it was just a good moment and nothing happens by accident for us to be having this conversation tonight and there's so many connections. When you really start to pull back the layers and because we're so caught up in our routines and the normalcy of what we expect, we miss things. You know, we miss moments.
Speaker 3:And again, I'm inspired just to continue to increase, even outside of adoption. But in general and this is something me and my husband try and do is, if you make it normal, it is normal, right, you make diversity and different religions and adoption and different types of families and single parenting and divorce and marriage and all of these things normal to your kids, then it just will be. But if they never see a gay couple or a mixed race family, that will not be normal and they will go and be like that doesn't look like our family. No, it doesn't. And you have that open conversation. So even with, like, social media and YouTube channels and things like that, showing them different types of people, people that look different, that sound different, and then having conversations with them when it comes up and interacting with them of like, oh, he has two mommies, oh, he, probably he maybe calls one mama and one mommy, just like you call mom and dad.
Speaker 3:They're two people, they have different things and I have, you know, whenever my birth mother said something, it's like that's my birth mom, Just like you were in my tummy. I was in her tummy and then grandma and grandpa raised me and it's just like, it's just a normal. It doesn't have to be a big deal, it doesn't have to have this big sit down, wait type conversation, especially when they're really little like mine, but it's just normal. So when they do get to an age like your daughters that are able to have more in-depth conversations, it's not like you're adopted, it's like no, that's you know, you know who.
Speaker 3:Who Linda is Linda, you know she. She sends gifts, she says this she like gave you those rackety hands you play with. Oh yeah, no, I know. Or you know, she sent that Valentine's day gift and blah, blah, blah, blah, you know, did a video chat with her. You know, it's just just, it's normal stuff and I think that's just important raising kids in general, even outside of adoption, it's just make it normal. I'm dyslexic. My kids know I'm dyslexic, they know I had trouble reading and I got a ged. It doesn't make someone less than just means differently and that's why you're gonna come across people that learn differently in school two things with that One I got to tell my kids.
Speaker 1:you know there are many ways to get to the end destination.
Speaker 1:Some people take the interstate, some people take the HOV, some people drive through the town Long as you get to where you're supposed to go. That's the important thing. The second thing I would say is that when I was in the school system and I would do trainings and I would talk to the elementary school teachers, I would tell them be mindful, when you celebrate these holidays, that everybody's narrative is different. You know, what about those kids who their parents may have passed away? They're not looking forward to a Mother's Day coming up. You know, you have to make sure that you are addressing everyone in that classroom because everybody's entitled to make sure that you are addressing everyone in that classroom because everybody's entitled, you know. So that's again looking back. I've always been a champion for the underrepresented, you know, and not really understanding and knowing why, but it's just always. I've always looked at it from a different angle, like the what if? Helping me understand my why?
Speaker 3:No, I love that and I love that and I love that, just that representation of people and making sure that, like it's like the underdog in any movie we're all rooting for them and it's like just acknowledging them and then raising our youth to acknowledge that and to that be a norm for them of not everyone has a mom for mother's day, not everyone has a dad, some people for christmas at two different houses, and that's really hard. They have two Christmas trees, or one's Jewish, and they don't celebrate at both houses. Like, and it's just talking about that, acknowledging that and them not being so surprised when the world hits them in the face, because at some point it will. And I love this analogy as parents that were their coaches and that they're going to play a game of life and we can coach them, we can train with them, we can scrimmage. When it comes to the game, we cannot step on the field and there's going to be some wins. There's going to be some hard losses, a couple of ties here and there. They're going to get hurt, they're going to do great at some points, but it's like all we can do is just cheer them on and if they need to come back, they can come off, they can talk to us, we can be there, we can be their coach and they'll get back in. But our job is just that one day they'll be their own coach and they'll have their own team, and that's what we're we're raising, and it's like you want them to get to that point. You don't want them to be just sitting on the bench with you the whole time, you want them out.
Speaker 1:I'm trying to find a button to hit touchdown or score. Exactly that is yes. I needed to hear that a few months ago when my daughter first started college, because I was trying to be on the field. And like you said, I got the headset on. I'm up top in the booth. Hey, I got the scouting report. I've seen this. I've seen this Lifetime movie. I know how it ends.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you definitely can't, because I know when my daughter went to college for cheerleading and my other daughter was graduating, so the day of her graduation party was the day that my daughter had cheerleading tryouts, so and the coach was a little difficult, but I couldn't step in and call the coach and say, hey, you know, I need my daughter not to you know, or let her try out first so she can come to her sister's party. I couldn't do any of that. I had to deal with herself. So she ended up unfortunately not coming to the party because I guess the coach had it out for her. So she made her go last when she could have just as easily allowed her to go. And I'm sure, if I had called but again, if I had called and put my mom hat on and my authority, then how would that be for her? Because she would have been the one had to deal with the consequences it would have been bad right and I'm not there, so I allowed her to work it out herself.
Speaker 2:Unfortunately, it didn't work out in her favor. But that's when you have to really not say, okay, I can't be involved, I can't. After a certain point, you have to draw the line and allow them to try and get through whatever they need to get through. Whether they fail or not, you still have to be there to allow them to do that. So it's tough. It's a tough situation.
Speaker 3:And also I just want to applaud you because you raised two independent women who are able to do those things, and that's what you did. And you now have girls on the field who are living life and they can handle it. And it's like, of course, as parents, we want to be there, but it's like knowing that you raise such strong women that can be there for themselves and get knocked down and get back up and handle it. It's like, even on the bad days, like you got this and it's like you raised that and it's like that's proud. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, cause we're not always going to be there as long as we instill what we need to instill in them. Regardless of you know how we were raised or our own journeys, my journey was definitely different from yours and John's, because I didn't know until I was almost 40. So everything was completely normal to me up until that time.
Speaker 2:And then everything starts, you know, crashing on me. You know like, oh my gosh, this is not my real life. So all my experience is like this is for Lisa, but I'm not Lisa, I'm someone else and this is her life. So you know, I had to struggle with that and because I was older, my kids were a little, a little bit older, so it was a roller coaster. Trying to kind of explain my journey with them. See, yours was all open and you're, you're already normalizing it for your kids. I didn't really have that opportunity because I kept it a secret for some time before they found out that I was you had to process it.
Speaker 2:I had to process it because I didn't want to kind of blow their world up until I kind of understood it.
Speaker 3:You couldn't answer questions until you had those answers yourself.
Speaker 2:Unfortunate part is that I didn't get that opportunity because they discovered it on their own and then they confronted me with it. Like you know, they had documents that I had on the fax machine and they, they found them and they brought is this true? So that's how it came out to them. So that was. That was you know a lot. They were, they were devastated.
Speaker 3:You know they're like wait a minute my life is not my life.
Speaker 2:I was like your life is your life. I'm the one who is about to relax.
Speaker 3:It has to be hard because it's the people that are closest to you and it feels like a lie, I imagine, of just why would you lie? I know it's changing so much now in this new, in the 20th century adoption style, but I imagine anything that my parents used to keep from me. It always just felt very big and just like a lot, and I was still young but it was. You know. Why did you lie Like you, my people, my two people? Why did you lie to me? You know?
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:Right, but then they have and you have to respect. Well, I eventually understood why they she didn't tell us. I mean, I think my father, my father was the type of person that he'll go along with whatever she decided to do. So you know, like, if she's not going to tell him, ok. So it was really my mom and you know, I kind of understood once.
Speaker 2:I kind of got a good idea of why she did what she did. Because she's been trying, she was trying to have children for four years and wasn't, wasn't successful. I don't know the details, whether she, you know, whether she was ever pregnant and had miscarriages or whatever. I don't know the details of that. But whatever it was, the last resort for her to have children was adoption and they agreed to do that. And then, once she had adopted my brother and then adopted me, it was like okay, they're mine, no one else my brother, and then adopted me. It was like, okay, they're mine, no one else, you know, moving forward, no one tell them, in a sense. Until we found out, no one, no one ever, you know, no one ever slipped to even tell us that and that was pretty much her kids and that's how it was. But I understood as a mother. I understood once I found out why she did what she did. I totally understood.
Speaker 2:At first I was angry. I'm like why would you lie? Mother was kind of fearful. When you first went down to meet with your biological mother, I feel that my mother was fearful of me even saying, hmm, I want to know about my biological mother, I want to go searching for her, which I wouldn't have. But she doesn't know that and she would have threatened because I know the type of person she was and I also had the opportunity to meet my biological mother. So I know the type of person she was. But you could not have lived in my world at the same time. So all things happen for a reason.
Speaker 3:That's very true.
Speaker 1:We find our families. Tasha, I have a question. So you talked about you know your adoption was the typical 90s adoption or traditional adoption. So a couple of questions about that. First one you know you talked about your dad being refused the DNA test and then waiting till you were 18. Were 18. What were his rights with that open adoption? Did he have a right to go to you at the age of 11 if he wanted to request a DNA test? What are the parameters or the rights within that open adoption?
Speaker 3:So with an open adoption, they have no rights. So my parents have full rights from the time I left Florida and the paperwork was sealed. The main part of an open adoption was the choice to keep my birth family kind of in the loop of my life and keeping me partially in theirs. So my parents still made decisions that I don't agree with. My parents would send gifts, and if my parents didn't agree with those gifts, they would just donate them, and that was something that I wish they hadn't done, because those would be very sweet to have now. But my mom didn't like Barbies and my birth mother would send Barbies and she would just say, no, we're not letting Sasha play with Barbies. And they were able to make those calls and I found out about them when I was much older, did your biological mom know that we're not giving her this.
Speaker 3:Yeah, she. They were very open with her and said please don't send any more Like this is not what we're giving Sasha and what we're exposing her to. Um, and they gave different things but it was. It's weird and eyeopening. I had a.
Speaker 3:I was adopted by my mom and dad and my dad's Jewish, and my mom was raised Catholic. Um, but my mom was not religious and my birth family, my grandmother, was Jewish and she or was um Catholic and German and she was big into Christmas and she was very concerned that I was being adopted by a Jew. So she crocheted Christmas blanket and she gave it to them. When I was born and I actually recently spoke to my husband because my mom, once I was out of the house, she never put up a tree she gave me all of her ornaments, all the cookie cutters. She was like take it, you like Christmas.
Speaker 3:But in my head I'm like did they celebrate Christmas so big? Because they were honoring what my birth family's wishes were, which was to celebrate Christmas in a big way, cause I always had Hanukkah with my dad and his family and then I would have Christmas with my mom for many, many years and it would be these big parties and everything, but that's not really who she is Right, and so I think that was a way they honored the want of that side of the family.
Speaker 2:It could have been one of the you know a deal that they made. Yeah, and I, that's a. I appreciate that your mom did that, because that's her sacrificing for you.
Speaker 3:Definitely they, and that's, I think, something that comes with parenting in general. But when it comes to like meshing two families with genetics, with differences, with all these things, you know it's honoring and I love that word honoring my birth family and honoring my biological history and that just being part of our life. And it wasn't just like they adopted me and then they were like okay, you are now cut from our cloth. They were saying you're cut from a different cloth and we're going to honor that cloth in multiple ways and we're going to make sure that you have friends that are also adopted. And I didn't know these things were going on. But I had a really close girlfriend for many years in lower school. She was adopted by a single mom. I did not know that my parents purposely made sure that friendship was there and that we were in the same like clubs together. But my mom was like, oh yeah, no, me and her mom would talk all the time. We always wanted to do girls together.
Speaker 3:I was like I didn't even know that it was just that was my best friend.
Speaker 2:But you know why, maybe she? Why didn't she? Why didn't they disclose that you both were adopted?
Speaker 3:Oh, we, they, we did so. We both knew we were adopted.
Speaker 3:They just didn't disclose that they were kind of pushing us on the same direction, because I think they were trying to create just a kinship between us where they were like they have each other, they have that similarity. So if they do, yeah, so if they do want to talk about it. And it was different. You know, she was adopted by a single mother. She never had a father. She was married. She didn't have a father-daughter dance. She just was never raised with a father. But that was her situation.
Speaker 2:But that to me was normal because that was my best friend's family.
Speaker 1:And it was just.
Speaker 3:That's how it is.
Speaker 1:Like it wasn't some shock. Like, oh my gosh, again normalizing the non-traditional having the discussions. So you said you, recently, I guess, did a little more research. What's different now with the? Well, before I even ask that, going back, you said that the parents have the right to control. They have all the rights once the file is sealed. Is there an agreement with hey, we're going to continue to keep you involved for X amount of time, or it's just whenever they say enough is enough, then it's done.
Speaker 3:So this is kind of the sad part about it, in my opinion, is that the adoptive family can pull the plug at any time. The kid has no say. In certain States it's 18, in certain States it's 21 that the child has a say. Um, but my mom actually became an adoption agent after adopting me and there were more than a few cases where a family would go into it saying I would like an open adoption with my biological child. Birth mom is on board, finds adoptive family, adoptive family's on board, baby's born, everything's sealed.
Speaker 3:Parents say, by the way, we're not telling them they're adopted, pound sand and the birth family has no right. They can't search them Facebook, they can't message them. There were some really sad cases involving that, where that just happened and the rug was pulled out from under them. So really it is completely up to the parents of the child the, you know, raising the child to make all the decisions. Um, and I was just really lucky that I had parents that were like here here's the information you know you can, once I became a certain age, I could email them myself, I could ask to call them.
Speaker 3:Um, but yeah, a lot of that happens, uh, happened and uh, it's definitely there's a lot of really sad stories around children finding out and being like I'm adopted, just like you said, like you didn't know until you were in your forties. And there's children who find out in their adolescence and they have real traumas with it because they're going through all of those hormones and just already having a hard time. And then they realize their parents lied and this was supposed to happen. Now they feel you know, just I can't imagine what they feel honestly, but it's, it's, I'm sure, very hard.
Speaker 2:And it's an open adoption. So so the biological parents really have no rights in an open adoption.
Speaker 3:Yeah, the only thing is contact. So the only thing of an open adoption is that the parents of the child allow contact with the birth family and keep contact. So normally that would happen where you would say, okay, every six months let's send pictures and postcards and they would send it to the adoption agency. The adoption agency would send it to the birth family but they would have no contact, partially to protect each other, so no one would go to each other's houses, there'd be no stalking. I guess was like the original thing, and now people are like hanging at the park with their birth family.
Speaker 3:I spoke to a woman at the conference two weeks ago. She's a birth mom to a five-year-old boy. The parents of her biological son were there watching. She had him and he was in the NICU for three weeks. They spent every day in the NICU all together, all nurturing. They go to playgrounds, they come over to each other's houses. They're like full-blown, like oh no, this is like auntie, like that's the vision that I had. Yeah, so that's now kind of.
Speaker 3:I think the more norm now is like this person that's in the child's life, but not a parent, it's just. You know, this birth mother was saying, you know she went to Europe for six months so obviously she didn't see them during that time. But like that's the freedom she got by not raising her child and by giving him up for adoption and giving him parents is because she wanted to be more free. But she's also a call away if he has, if he has questions. And now she's back in the area and she's like, oh yeah, no, we just had lunch the other day, you know, this is his favorite spot, you know, and they're all. I think the beauty is they're all so proud of the kid and it's a child centered thing now. Like adoption is all about the child and what the child needs and what the child wants and the questions the child has. And there's so much support of even if a child knows they're adopted and doesn't ask any questions. There's so much support around adoption now of well, do you want your parents to search for your bio parents and just have that information if you do want it one day? You know there's just so much out there now and it was.
Speaker 3:It was so funny because the one of the other panelists was a biological father and his adult son and he's like, oh yeah, yeah, we run into each other on the subway all the time. We live like a block from each other. Wow, wow, and it's just like you know and it's it's crazy, but he still respects, even though that boy was an adult. He still respects his parents wishes where they no longer have contact with the biological mother because of her own stuff which I'm not sure about, but they're like we don't want her to know that you have contact. So if you see her, please don't tell her. You know him and you see him and so that's just a respect point of he's. Those are his parents and I'm going to respect them.
Speaker 3:I feel like that's just any like family member or friend If you have. You know someone else with kids and they're like, hey, don't feed them that, hey, we're not doing screen time, and you just respect that because they're their kids. So I think that that's how open adoption has evolved into of you're the parents. I'm a bio mom. I don't have the right to tell you how to parent. I don't have the right to do anything legally, nothing. It's just I'm here and I have love for this beautiful child and I have love for your family that you're creating and you're raising my biological child and I'm here as a friend, as a family member, as someone who loves them too and who loves you and wants to make this child's life as open as possible and have all the questions answered.
Speaker 2:Right Wow.
Speaker 1:That is awesome.
Speaker 2:I have a question so, going back to your mother and when you found out that when you were younger she wasn't certain gifts like the Barbie dolls, how did you feel once you found out to your mother?
Speaker 3:Oh, I told her she was being petty. I said you're being petty, she goes. I probably was a little overbearing and I was like it's okay, I'm a mom, I get it, it's just I was like a Barbie and she was like I know. But my mom sometimes says she said that she was a neurotic. Older parent is what she describes herself as and her and my dad divorced and she's now married to another man and he had I have a stepbrother from him and she goes. Me and your stepdad were just neurotic older parents who didn't really know what to do and we were just grasping at straws and she's like there's stuff I would change. But I think, like looking at her now and looking at all of those decisions she made change. But I think, like looking at her now and looking at all of those decisions she made, she was always doing the best she could and I think that that's all you can ask of your parents.
Speaker 3:So I think we're able to joke about those things now and there's no hard feelings. Of course, I would have rather have them, but now my daughter has those Barbies. My birth mother sent her Barbies and I'm like that's cool, like I'm going to throw out probably the shoes because they're a choking hazard. Right, maybe she'll be mad at me for that, because maybe those little shoes will be going up on ebay one day for twenty thousand dollars. Why didn't you let me have those little cinderella shoes, like they were a choking hazard. So I made the decision, as your parent, to get rid of them. And it's like you know, we're all gonna we're flop sometimes Like, yeah, we have to be able to say we're doing our best. That's all we can ask of our kids, of our family, of ourselves, and that's, you know, what my parents did. They did their best they could.
Speaker 1:And I'm glad that you brought up you know doing the best that you can with what you have yeah, when you shared about the book that was read to you, I remember I had a birth facts book and I cherished it. It was in the top of my closet growing up and I showed my friends. I was like no, I am adopted, look at this. Never opened the book Again, not knowing. And when I opened the book it just had the time I was born, you know some basic information. But to have had that book where it I could have seen myself in my story, um, because there were moments looking back where I wasn't embarrassed. I just didn't have the language or the ability to process what I was of, who I was from that, from that angle. So talk to me a little bit about the books that you've written, like First Day and just the inspiration of that, because, again, that's a void that I didn't have and I'm like man, how, how much more mentally would I have been prepared for my journey had I had that?
Speaker 3:Yeah. So I wrote first day an adoption story in so many versions and initially I wrote it as just my story and I was like, oh yeah, this is perfect. And I wanted to share it with some friends. And I was like, oh well, they don't have the same adoption story I do. Oh, they don't have. And I was like I don't really know anyone who was adopted like from infancy, who knew their birth family. And I was like, okay, well, let's rework this. And I sent it to some connections that my mom had in the industry and they said, what's the reason you're writing this? And I was like, well, I want people to be able to read their own story. I want them to be able to have that book, like you said, to be proud and to know.
Speaker 3:And I actually have a blank calendar where families can fill out the first day they became a family, which might not be the child's birthday, but it's to open up that dialogue of this was our first day as a family. And then it's a bunch of analogies of you traveled far and wide. You don't have my ankles, my feet or my toes, but you walk in my footsteps. With each one, our love grows, we have the words. Such a beautiful face, though not mirroring mine, and so it's just a bunch of analogies, where it doesn't talk about specifics but it allows for that open dialogue and at the very end it has a space for my first day story. And so we have about 10 to 20 pages of blank blind paper where people can write in their own adoption story so that children can have that at the end, so they can, I'm sure, read the book when they're little, but when they're older they can have that writing, as it's happening, from the parents where they can share their child's story and they can have it in there as a little memento for them, because I love hearing about it. But I don't have anything written for my childhood. I have my little book my mom gave me about how often I pooped and drank and burped and all of those little things that she held on to, which I love, but I didn't have anything written down about my adoption story until I became much older and I kind of asked them and we filled in a couple of blanks. But I really wanted to write something that would allow for parents to write it from that first day and my goal is that I had biological children and I had pregnancy books that I would write first trimester.
Speaker 3:Here are my cravings and my goal is to make one for adoption where it's a huge fill in the blank where parents can fill out. You know what was your child wearing when you first met them? What did they bring with them? You know what? When did you decide on adoption? How was that decision made? Who did you speak to? You know what was your first introduction?
Speaker 3:Just all of those little details which some families may not have and some families may have all of. But I want to create basically a fill in the blank pregnancy book, but for adoption, so that they can have those little details, cause I love those and I love being able to hand those down to my kids and have the sonogram pictures and you know, have little things about when they lost their first tooth and it's like I don't see any of those for adoption where it's very specific into what other people have, and so I'd love that. And then, especially hearing how open adoption is now is having one for birth families to fill out, you know, obviously with the comfort of the adoptive families, but you know, whenever that child is ready to have that.
Speaker 1:That's, that's amazing. That's like John, because I think John, when he was born, or she, said, yes, she would come every week and we would talk for about an hour and I would just be ready for her to go. Um, but she wrote, I mean, I was when I got the file. It answered so many questions and created so many more, you know, because it was well. What was she thinking Um? You know, because it was well, what was she thinking um? You know what was the, the pregnancy journey like? And you know, did she ever contemplate back and forth? Where was she at? And it it had all those things in there, you know. So it, it, it was just, it was a tool, like you said. It was a tool that was interesting.
Speaker 1:Um, my, my first mom. I asked her. I said you know, do you want the file? She was like no, and I think that you know, it's still, it's still tender for her. You know, and I respect her position and I said her all the time. I said I'm just thankful because you could have still kept your barriers up, but you were willing to at least allow some form of connection and communication. So what I'm not going to do is abuse that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I had a similar. I sent my birth mother a book that was a fill in the blank of, like mom, I want to get to know you. And she called me and she said, honey, you can ask me any question you want. I just don't like writing down and I said, okay, thank you, and I was like, okay, cool, like, I would love to have that and you have every right to say no. Like, and I'm glad the door is still open, like, yeah, that is amazing.
Speaker 1:So, where can individuals get your books? Let's, let's put that out there.
Speaker 3:Yes, sasha Sedmancom, the world of Sasha Sedman. I have seven books out. Dunk in the Garden just came out, but I love speaking through experience and writing those books through experience. I think it's really special when someone can connect with that and I really wanted to be an adoptee who wrote something that more people could connect with and meeting a bunch of adoptees recently and you guys, it's like it's great because it just broadens everyone's spectrum of what adoption is and what families can look like.
Speaker 1:We're definitely. Well, we talked about it. I'm going to be in the next conference because I want to be in that space. A young lady that I went to college with whole time we were there did not know that she was adopted and we talked and you know she said that she would never have kids because of her journey. But she will be the best aunt and, you know, supporter, so definitely will be that. So I have a question for you. I'll put you on the spot out of your seven books, which one is your favorite?
Speaker 3:Yep, there it is so, personally, my favorite to read right now is all out of ducks. What is that about? Read right now is All Out of Ducks. What is that about? It's a play on parents being all out of the F word, okay.
Speaker 1:Is there an age limit on this? There are no bad words.
Speaker 3:There are no bad words in this book. There are no curse words. There is nothing bad. I was given the book Go the F to Sleep as a gift for my baby shower and it's hilarious. But the F word is consistently throughout this book. And I have a really good friend who does not curse around. Her kids will not accept the book in her household. Her son's reading, you know absolutely not. And so I started writing this book because I had postpartum depression.
Speaker 1:Yes, and I thought to myself.
Speaker 3:You know how difficult it was parenting from any perspective and how hard it is to be a parent to young, young children and to be all out of ducks. And also the struggle of parents not to curse around their kids and try to set a good example. So the book follows a mom on a day with her young child, trying to create a day of not cursing but also just trying to make it the best day. So there's moments of trying to get out the door and the kid runs out the door and you're like fish don't run in the street. But the way we did it was. We illustrated all of these animals that they used instead of cursing. And at the end of the book the house is a zoo full of these animals, all of these words. And this parent is looking at their sleeping child saying I'm so grateful that I get the opportunity to parent you and I'm so grateful that my house is a zoo because I'm raising you. I'm raising you in this zoo household and I'm exhausted and I'm all out of ducks and I wouldn't change a thing on your head. But, duck, is it nice when you finally go to bed? And I love reading it to my kids because they love all of the animals, and then I can also get a bit of a giggle out of it. And I love reading it to my kids because they love all of the animals and then I can also get a bit of a giggle out of it.
Speaker 3:And the most important part to me is that there's a phone number on the very front of it and that is the National Maternal Hotline phone number for calling or texting 24 seven for maternal mental health. And I did not know about this phone number when I was postpartum. I just knew about the suicide hotline and so I would call that when I was depressed and I was able to get help. But it wasn't specific. And so when I wrote this book, I wanted to make sure for new parents, older parents, for fresh parents, of the little tiny itty bitties, they have a phone number that they can reach out to when they're having a hard time and when they're all out of ducks. And they can also know that it's normal to be all out of ducks, that raising children is hard, and I wanted to put it on the front. So wherever the book is, the phone number is, so parents don't have to look for it, they can just see it right on the front, and it's right there and all the animals are looking at it.
Speaker 2:And what's the number? Oh, I just ordered it, I'm going to put it in.
Speaker 1:I'm going to put it in.
Speaker 3:The phone number is 1-833-853-6262. And I believe it translates to 1-833-TLC-MAMA.
Speaker 2:We're going to have that on there.
Speaker 1:So somewhere on the website my book will be here from.
Speaker 2:Wednesday.
Speaker 1:And what's going to be even more powerful. I'm going to read it with my daughters. Oh, I love that because my daughter's here on spring break. So you know, and I know it's cheesy, but you know, you try and get that reconnection time. Like sunday morning we went and hopped on the bed and she's like, let's, let me sleep like it's 12 o'clock, get up like we want to spend our time, but one night before she goes back I'm going to read the book, because we haven't had a story time, because I think Even at this age I got less ducks.
Speaker 3:Yeah, some days we're all out of ducks and that's OK. And I think I have a moment in there and one of my friends will say it where, like I'm just rotting on the sofa, like if your kids are content and doing something, and you're like, have dishes piled up, have laundry to do, but everyone's like content, you're like I'm not going to move, I'm just going to sit and rot. And I put that in the book where the mom is sitting on the floor feeding an apple to the pig. Just like I'm just going to lay here because the kid's content playing. Like I'm just going to lay here because the kid's content playing, I'm just going to take a moment of silence.
Speaker 3:And then all chaos breaks loose again because you're trying to do dishes, make dinner, someone's knocking at the door, the kid's trying to open the door to the stranger. You know there's an alligator licking the yogurt off the ceiling. Who knows how it got there. You know, it's just the chaos and I shared it with so many of my girlfriends and we all laugh about it and we have that now and we have those moments and we share them and it's normal.
Speaker 1:It's okay to be all out of ducks, we all we call that funky saturday around here and we get at least four a year. Okay, listen, I'm not leaving the house. If you eat, you eat. If you get, if you eat dry cheerios, that's it's you. It's all good, just fend for yourself.
Speaker 3:You said four days a year. It's Monday. I'm on two days. My kid was eating a Pop-Tart outside in the grass. I was repainting the lawn, that's all right.
Speaker 1:Build character, you're fine.
Speaker 3:That's right, you're fine. My daughter picked up a Starbucks cup off of tractor supply floor and took a sip of it.
Speaker 1:I don't know where it came from.
Speaker 3:I called my husband. I said well, about three days she'll be sick. I don't know who left it there. But some frappuccino, something. Oh my, she's two, and she was as content as can be. I'm like all right, this is how it is, this is like it is.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's funny, that is sasha this has been so enlightening and powerful. Yes, one to hear your story and to be inspired by it, but then the resource. That's the, the thing that is motivating for us. We want to be a resource for individuals. Um, not only the platform, but connecting the dots and empowering people. Um, and also because I work with, um, children with autism, that's a whole different avenue, so that I'm all out of ducks. That's something I'm going to share with them, with those parents, as well.
Speaker 1:Because they're like I said, that's a whole different soundtrack and I have two parents that I'm working with that are new to this journey of having a child with autism and sometimes you have to be okay with not knowing. You have to be okay with I'm wrestling with this right now. So I'm just excited to enhance my tools and to be able to support you and what you're doing. And, yeah, this is, this was good, this was very good. I knew. I knew when we, when we talked before, I said it's something, this is going to be a special, this was good, this was very good. I knew when we talked before, I said this is going to be a special episode.
Speaker 3:Yeah, this is great. I loved connecting and I'd love to connect you guys with Barker and the people I know in the industry and just get everyone connected. I know they have their annual conference and they have other conferences around the United States, I think, with other adoption facilities. I'm trying to get in contact with them too and get my book out there. Speak out there, you know just.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. Do you have a social media presence?
Speaker 3:I do. My son went viral on TikTok because he was chunky, so we have like 180,000 followers. Okay, cause he was chunky, so we have like 180,000 followers.
Speaker 3:Okay, however you get it. I, you know, I um, I started a tech talk, um, because I had recurring pregnancy losses and I connected with the trying to conceive community and mama rainbow, baby mamas and a bunch of those mamas shared and supported me through my journey and having my son. And then my son was exponentially chunky and round and a couple of his videos went viral and we got all the hate, all the love and so we just kind of kept with it and hung out and I have that and that's under the underscore. Kowalskis, if you want to update on my family, we are outside dirt bike riding, we're thinking about getting chickens.
Speaker 1:We are underscore.
Speaker 3:Kowalskis. Yeah, k-o-w-a-l-s-k-i. It's my married name and I use my given name, sedeman, for my books.
Speaker 2:Okay, I will definitely put that in the you will find me on one of these ends? Yeah, taekwondo.
Speaker 3:Yep.
Speaker 2:Yep, there it is.
Speaker 3:He actually. It's so funny. My husband got to that back to the house at 629 tonight right or 659, right before our podcast with my son coming back from karate and to help me with my daughter, so she didn't have to be in here initially.
Speaker 1:Got it. Well, we definitely will put that information up so that people can get those resources. Like I said, I instantly I got the book. Those of you who you know Amazon, wherever platform you get it on, please get it. It's a resource to help. Any last words I don't want to say last words, but any concluding words for this session that you would like to give, whether it's somebody who is all out of ducks, is it somebody who is beginning this journey, or somebody who's contemplating, or somebody who wants to start the journey, because they want answers.
Speaker 3:You know the platform is yours for your Sasha's words of wisdom.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think just to remember that any feelings you have are valid and any feelings other people have are valid are valid and any feelings other people have are valid.
Speaker 3:And so there can be a dialectic of those where you can feel multiple ways at once and you need to give yourself grace and you also need to acknowledge that other people can have a multitude of emotions, including your children, all at once, and that that's okay.
Speaker 3:And if we are all out of ducks, you know I can say that and I can still have every love in the world and you know, ram a bus for my kids, you know, at the same time as being exhausted by them and tired, and so I think there's an idea if you're complaining about your journey or where you're at, you're not grateful for it, and I think that that couldn't be more from the truth. So I think, like the parents you work with with children who are struggling, it's it's okay to be struggling and it's okay to say you're struggling and it's okay to be all out of ducks, and no parent in the world will ever think less of you and your children will ever think less of you because of that and, I think, more of my parents, because they told me when they were all out of ducks and they were honest, because I can now tell them and it's just, it's normal that helps.
Speaker 1:That helps so many times. We try and paint this perfect inside the lines illustration and that's sometimes the furthest from the truth.
Speaker 3:Yeah, color outside the lines, do it all. Yeah, color outside the lines. Do it all Just throw a bunch of seeds out in the wind. See what happens.
Speaker 1:Broken crayons still color.
Speaker 3:Exactly. I love that Broken crayons still color. And remember to be your kid's coach, not playing next to them. They'll play the game.
Speaker 1:There, it is that part right there. Well, we thank everybody for investing time. I know that you were empowered by this discussion. I'm John and I'm Lisa. I'm Sasha. We are all adopted. And again, please send us any feedback. You have Hit the like, hit the share. Just get the information out. Go out and support Sasha with the book on TikTok. Follow her. I'm a fan, so I'm going to be watching getting updates on it.
Speaker 2:And also if you want to share your story or your journey, please reach out to us.
Speaker 1:You can find us on Instagram and TikTok and Facebook all these platforms alright, thank y'all thank you until next time, until the next episode thank you for listening to the Soul of Adopted podcast. We hope that this was informative and educational. Thank you for listening to the so I'm Adopted podcast. We hope that this was informative and educational. You can follow us on Instagram and Facebook at so I'm Adopted. Also, subscribe to our YouTube channel, so I'm Adopted. And again, thank you for listening and until next time, make the choice to begin your healing journey.
