So.... I'm Adopted Podcast!
This podcast creates a space for genuine conversations about adoption, where emotions are acknowledged, journeys are reconciled, and a healthy acceptance of truths is fostered. Delve into the impact of adoption on all parties involved, gaining insights from adoptees, adoptive parents, biological parents, as well as professional psychologists and social workers. Explore the realities, reconciliation processes, and ongoing dynamics of adoption.
So.... I'm Adopted Podcast!
Fatherly Wisdom and Cherished Traditions
Join us as John shares the heartwarming and emotional journey leading up to his daughter Jayla's graduation, a milestone that brought his family together in unexpected ways. Lisa and John open up about the profound impact of non-traditional relationships and the emotional layers that come with adoption, highlighting the involvement of John's first mother in their celebration. This episode is a testament to the humility, wisdom, and strength that define familial bonds.
We also explore how adoption has shaped the lives of legendary figures like Steve Jobs and John Lennon. Discover how Jobs' adoptive parents nurtured his unconventional learning style, paving the way for his groundbreaking work at Apple, and how John Lennon’s upbringing by his aunt and uncle may have influenced his musical and artistic legacy. These stories underscore the extraordinary potential within children who might be misunderstood in more traditional settings, spotlighting the critical role adoptive environments play in fostering remarkable achievements.
Reflecting on the search for biological connections, we delve into the bittersweet discoveries and emotional complexities that come with uncovering one's roots. From societal pressures on maternal bonds to the practical importance of medical history, we navigate the nuanced journey of acceptance and self-discovery. As we celebrate cherished family traditions and the enduring influence of our father's wisdom, we encourage you to appreciate every connection and make the most of the time with your loved ones. Dive into humorous anecdotes, valuable life lessons, and heartfelt reflections in this episode dedicated to the evolving roles and invaluable support of a father.
Music by Curtis Rodgers IG @itsjustcurtis
Produce and Edited by Lisa Sapp
Executive Producer Lisa Sapp
Executive Producer Johnnie Underwood
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Welcome to the so I'm Adopted podcast, where we talk everything adoption. This journey is not one we take alone. Together we grapple with raw emotions that surface from adoption stories. We want you to be comfortable enough to heal, so sit back and go with us on this journey as we dive deep into adoption.
Speaker 1:We wanted to create a space for adoption truth. We have a common bond of being adopted. Our stories are very, very different, absolutely. So we wanted to have our conversations and allow other people to hear our conversations and also be able to share theirs as well.
Speaker 2:You know, this podcast is where we will hear our adoption stories from other adoptees, adoptive parents and biological families. We will also have input from licensed professionals such as psychologists, social workers, to get a deeper understanding of this adoption journey. Hopefully, these stories and perspectives will give hope and understanding and courage to those who are adopted or who are thinking about, you know, being adopted, along with the journey of acceptance, reconciliation and maintenance of being adopted. You know, those are going to be some of the anchors that we will highlight. Take one episode. What's the seven, eight, eight? Take one of episode eight Welcome, welcome, welcome to another episode of so we're Adopted, so I'm adopted. It's not we're adopted, but yes, we are adopted.
Speaker 1:I'm John and I'm Lisa and we are adopted.
Speaker 2:That's how it goes in the rotation. It's been a minute. It has been a minute, but we want to welcome you all for just welcome you into this space, where we want to have some transparent conversations about non-traditional relationships. We both have different journeys of how we got to this place and we wanted to create a safe space for individuals, because adoption impacts people in many different ways. And we wanted to create a safe space for individuals because adoption impacts people in many different ways and as we have continued on our journey, we've learned so much in a short amount of time, absolutely so again, we're going to jump right in.
Speaker 1:Yes, yes. So let's talk about our weekend. We spent a lot of time the past couple of weekends. Let's talk about our weekend. We spent a lot of time the past couple of weekends, haven't we together? Yes, we have.
Speaker 2:Yes we have. Yes, we have. We had Mother's Day last month and now it's June, and June is graduation month and Father's Day is coming up, and we just recently had graduation my oldest daughter, she graduated.
Speaker 1:Tell us about that, because I know how I felt when my first born graduated. I mean, I cried the whole time and just knowing you know, after all of that, it came to this day where they're getting ready to go to college. So I definitely feel your pain because it's an emotion. Not that I wasn't emotional when my youngest, when my son I have three so when my son graduated, but it is the first the first one really gets you, but I know it was an emotional rollercoaster for you.
Speaker 1:So share, share how that went for you.
Speaker 2:So I will tell you and I shared in the other episodes how, jayla being the first blood relative that I had a chance to meet we have a unique connection and the anticipation leading up to the graduation was humbling.
Speaker 2:I didn't know how I would feel the whole time. I'm like am I going to cry? I had a lump in my throat because I wanted to control that emotion, but I wanted to be present in the most in the moment as well. Right as we were leading up to the graduation, j began sending out her invitations and she sent out an invitation to my first mother and she sent out an invitation to my first mother. And it was so interesting because when my first mom got the invitation, she called me and she said is this from you or is this from Jayla? And I said it's from Jayla. And her comment was because this is not about you, this is about her celebrating her time.
Speaker 1:Right, right and it just.
Speaker 2:You know, that's that motherly wisdom.
Speaker 2:Yes, because I've had moments where I get too excited and in my own way. And she, she humbled me. She was like listen, this is not about you Right? This is her graduation, so as long as she's fine with it, I'm fine. So I asked Jayla. I said hey, baby girl, you good? She was like yeah. I said OK. So I went back with the report excited yeah, she said it's a go. But what was even more powerful was the Friday before or the Thursday before. I sent her the time that she needed to be there and the address and everything. And she, she responded back and she called me and she said listen, I know you all are social media people and you can. You know any pictures that you want to take, you can put me in anything that you want. And I had a. I was speechless for a moment. She just said you know, god is good.
Speaker 1:I can understand that because since we started the podcast, we've been very kick gloves, very respectful when it comes to her Respecting her space. It's a process. So for her to her, you know, respecting her space, respecting her space, it's a process. So for her to say, you know, I know how you know your world is, so I'm ready to step my toe in.
Speaker 2:It is a big deal and you know, I told her to come to the house before so we could all ride to graduation together, so I could park in a place, so she wouldn't have to walk. When she opened, when she rang the doorbell, I kind of was like a little kid, I feel you, she made some goodies. She was like this is for you. I was like I know exactly what that is.
Speaker 2:I'm not going to say what it is publicly because I don't want to get in trouble for my wife when she finds it in the house, but it's some good uh, non-healthy food yeah, well, we won't say nothing, um, but in that moment her coming, that was the first time she had come to the house, really, and that would be the first time that the village would have her in it oh, yes, and I can attest to that. Yes, I mean tell me how to let me, let me show you my experience. Give me your angle. So you know, because I've been, because I saw in the graduation, when everybody was sitting, you like went over there and y'all were talking.
Speaker 1:Oh, absolutely, you know I was. I couldn't wait. Yeah, talk to me. So, just because I had the same experience when my oldest daughter graduated college, that's awesome. My first mother was at her graduation, wow. So my first question to your mother, after I gave her a big hug and she said it's like I already know you. You know cause she watches.
Speaker 2:Thank you very much. Please subscribe.
Speaker 1:Please, yes, and um, you know. So you know I was overwhelmed and you know I'm a big baby. So I I was like oh my goodness. So I started talking to her. So my question was so what you know is, do you have other grandkids who have graduated, or or you know what's the, you know what's the story there. So she said, no, this will be my first, because I think she has a grandchild that's 10 or in a 10th grade, 10, 10. I was like, oh my goodness, so our stories are different, but our stories are so similar. So it's crazy, because my daughter was the first grandchild to graduate college. Wow, and really all of my children will be the first, all of my children will be the first, all of well, the first. And then I have a niece who's graduated as well, just graduated this year. So we've had a four of them ahead of Jasmine. Um, but Jasmine was the first and she was there.
Speaker 1:I mean, when I say let's like, your mom said that Jayla was like this is a big deal. It was a big deal when my mother was at Jasmine's graduation. It was a big deal when she came down, for when Maya graduated um, college as well, for her graduation party and it was a big deal when she came to TC's high school graduation. So she was there for both, all of them, where I didn't have my second mom there, you know, but I had my first mom there. If I had planned that any other way, it would have never happened. That's why I say God orchestrates all things well, absolutely All things well. So I'm talking to your mom and we're conversing and all this stuff, and she was just talking about exactly what you said. She said she wanted to be here because Jayla wanted her here. It wasn't about you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, she let me know.
Speaker 1:It wasn't about you and it's a process to go through and as long as Jayla wouldn't turn here, she was going to be there and I started like tearing up and stuff. So she's still talking. I'm trying to get myself together Because I don't want to start. You know what I'm saying? Because it's like the same thing that happened with me happened to you and I am so thankful that I was there to experience that.
Speaker 2:To me, that's a further illustration of why this podcast was supposed to happen. Yeah, you know it's too many parallels down this road, too many, and I just think that there will be countless others that can benefit from that.
Speaker 1:Absolutely, absolutely.
Speaker 2:You know, even having a discussion with somebody about how to start the process, because they were told you got to pay $500. Yeah, and I said, well, what? No, wait a minute, that's free information, yeah, you know. So I just think that we have the opportunity to impact so many people, to help people get to be a key, to help people unlock things.
Speaker 1:Yes, and if anything that we say can help someone along their own journey, then we're doing our job.
Speaker 2:Please. We got an email address if you want to send any questions. Facebook, instagram, all of that. We are here. This is an engaging platform.
Speaker 1:Yes, so please subscribe. So let's take a minute. Please subscribe, like and follow us on YouTube, Facebook and Instagram and all social medias, that's right.
Speaker 2:And.
Speaker 1:TikTok, we are on TikTok, we are on TikTok, oh my, goodness, I'm not even well.
Speaker 2:no, I do have TikTok, I think, but I don't know what to do.
Speaker 1:We are on TikTok, so please do that for us. We really, really appreciate it. And please bring your comments. We definitely like to hear from you, hear your stories. Again, if you want to come on the show, don't hesitate to reach out to us and we'll be more than happy, and it just doesn't have to be the adoptee. Anyone that's in relation or connected to the adoptee is what we're looking for. So again, wonderful, wonderful weekend. Your mom is amazing, oh, I mean, she is just a blessing. I enjoyed it just speaking to her during that little period of time, but yeah, I was getting filled.
Speaker 2:You know, the comment that I heard frequently was I see where you get it from. They were like our mannerisms.
Speaker 1:Oh, my goodness, and that's the thing, the same thing, the mannerisms. So we're trying to. So, listen, guys, we're trying to take, we're taking pictures outside after the graduation. So of course I'm come up with the one hey, everybody move, let the grandma and the grandchild and John's in the background. He's not a big dude, I mean, he's not a little dude, right. And we're like saying John, you're not small, move. But I know he was going through what he was going through at the time, because as I'm taking the picture I started getting emotions so I had to walk away. So it's like deja vu all over again for me. So again, I'm just glad I was there to witness it for myself once again, the excitement of it all, the full circle moment, I should say.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's why I put in my Facebook post she had intricate pieces of her village. Yes, you know, and it's, and it wasn't everybody there, it was 47 of us and you still had at least 10 people that you know weren't able to make it for various reasons yes yes, so, but again that was my weekend, so congratulations to all the graduates out there, yes, yes, If you have family members that graduated or if you graduated again.
Speaker 2:These are celebratory moments that we encourage, because now you have this tag or this moment connected to the graduation.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Graduations are things that are thought of for years and Jayla will always be able to say my grandma was there Exactly, you know. So that to me is priceless, and I didn't talk a lot, I just sat back and, like, really wanted to be present. So it was definitely a blessing and I'm glad that you were able to celebrate it with us and you did good.
Speaker 1:I appreciate it. You did, you did, I was right behind you. Yes, yes, yes, you kept your composure.
Speaker 2:There are some pictures of me crying, but I've been able to intercept those. But look, we're going to jump in. We started a new segment and we identify celebrities who have been adopted. Yes, so each week we try and bring some celebrities to just show you that there are more adoptees than you may be aware of. So we started this a few episodes back. So, Lisa, who do you have today?
Speaker 1:So I have someone that I believe everybody already knew. He was adopted.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:So I kind of went with another angle, knowing that he was adopted, but what kind of made him who he was, who he became? Okay, how did that impact him as being an adoptee? Ok, all right, so my person is Steve Jobs.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I didn't know he was adopted.
Speaker 1:So so that's not a mystery. Ok, all right, but I found a few things about him as a child and different things. So his parents first parents were weren't married, but they were grad students. So right, there indicates that he's probably going to be a smart kid just because both his parents were in grad school. So they were. You know, further along, his adoptive father was a mechanic, a machinist, sorry and his mom was an accountant. So he was always around some type of a technical, you know, numbers-driven kind of environment. On top of what his DNA was, right Gotcha. So I'm going to read what I have. I thought it was pretty interesting.
Speaker 1:So when he was growing up, he was known as a rebellious student. Typically those types of kids that are disruptors are banned of behavior issues. But that's not really what they, because, you know this, it's because they're what Bored. That's right, you know this for a fact. And most of the time it's really because, in Steve Jobs' situation, he was bored. You know, in his early introduction to electronics, which his adoptive father kind of put that little spark into him Because they were trying to figure out what they can do with him outside of him being bored. You know he preferred practical learning. He wasn't a traditional learner, ok, so he kind of did things outside the box, which obviously probably frustrated administrators. Oh, yes, right, I'm sure. So that's what he kind of enjoyed doing, doing the untraditional way of learning. He was a college dropout, didn't you say?
Speaker 2:I did know that.
Speaker 1:I didn't know that. So he was only there for like one semester, but throughout his year he continued to take different classes. Right, he took a calligraphy class. Wow. So that later helped him with what Macintosh, you remember that? Did you have that?
Speaker 2:Of course I had a Mac.
Speaker 1:Yes, so that was part of what led that to him. So he also was. While he was in school, since he was a troubled kid, he had one teacher, his fourth grade teacher, who recognized his greatness. So what she did was kind of give him money or candy every time he completed an assignment.
Speaker 2:So she positively reinforced his behavior Positively.
Speaker 1:My thing is, I hope he gave her some Apple stock later in life. That's just me. We'll have to research that and find out, that's just me, but shout out to teachers. Shout out to teachers.
Speaker 2:Shout out to those fourth grade teachers. Yeah, it's the end of the school year, so big shout out to teachers for making it.
Speaker 1:Yes, Because those kids that are disruptors in your class today. You just don't know it could be the next steve job could be the next steve job.
Speaker 1:And with that, you know he always conflicted throughout his life with school administrators and with his colleagues. You know, because he was fired right at one point he was fired from apple and because he just bumping heads that disruptive child behavior is still was still in him later in life. But later on he did return back to Apple. But what really amazed me is how his adoptive parents facilitated, facilitated an environment that allowed him to cultivate his learning. You know they didn't do it the traditional way they like lead into the way he thought. You know they cultivated that they didn't. They didn't say, oh no, my child, the behavior child that he needs to go into what do you call those IPs or you, you know, or things, or just go with what the administrative was saying because of his behavior was disruptive and I can see that, with both of them being in grad school, encouraged learning well, not necessarily no, his, his biological parents oh, this is the adopted parents.
Speaker 2:These are the adopted parents. That's right, okay, got it.
Speaker 1:Yes, so they saw something in him as well, right, something that was going to be constructive later on. So I just thought that was amazing because of how he shaped technology today through his unconventional approach to life. That's powerful, because what I'm talking about right now I'm reading it off an Apple iPad we do not own the rights.
Speaker 1:We do not own the rights to Apple, but I had to make a point that this person who was considered a behavioral issue growing up, everything we use today is being recorded on something he developed, something he created. So a big thank you to Steve. So thanks, shout out to Steve. Behavioral Issues.
Speaker 2:That's right. So my person was John Lennon and I was shocked when I began to research. And we talk about non-traditional adoption can happen at different times. So what happened with John Lennon? His parents passed when he was three years old and he was adopted by his aunt and uncle.
Speaker 1:Oh, I did not know he was adopted.
Speaker 2:Why that part caught my attention? Because a lot of times and we had resources and different things talk about in family adoptions out of family adoptions that dynamic of here's, a situation where parents split up.
Speaker 2:It wasn't that they passed away, they were still there Right. And now my uncle say we'll take them Right. And as a result of you know that and I don't know if it was traumatic, we weren't there, but again, it's just non-traditional. So there's some level of trauma that was exposed Right and in spite of that he still maybe that some of the songs that he wrote about I had to go back and kind of research, research, that Wow.
Speaker 1:So just imagine the two people that we highlighted today. If they went the normal way, they didn't end up being adopted. Would they still be the person they were today? Never know We'll were today, never know We'll never know, never know.
Speaker 2:So the thought or the lesson in that is just be all you can be. Continue to press forward. Don't allow what your perceived circumstances are hinder you, because nobody can write what your narrative of life is.
Speaker 1:No, but you, that is know. But you, that is so true, that is so true. But listen, I love about our highlighted people.
Speaker 2:So father's day is coming up we get the big piece of chicken and you know everybody always talks about oh we always do mother's day.
Speaker 1:Everything's about mothersda. We wanted to make sure we did spend some quality time.
Speaker 2:It'll be a short show today.
Speaker 1:Speaking about, speaking about our father? Yeah, it will be a short show, no it's going to be a long show, a good show. Well, considering that we both don't know our biological father, it will be a short show.
Speaker 2:Potentially so.
Speaker 1:We'll talk about it. We're going to give it a nice quality time for.
Speaker 2:Father's Day.
Speaker 1:It's a good discussion that we can talk about our first and second fathers. I don't know about you, but I don't think I lost anything growing up. Well, I'm different because I didn't know until I was older, right, but now that I know that I was older, you know how well you knew. But when I first found out, it wasn't like, oh, I need to know who my biological. I wanted to know my biological family, but it's again. I'm sorry, but it's something about the mamas that we absolutely. You know what I'm saying. A mother's love is unmatched, unmatched. So I didn't have that same desire as I did to know who my mother was than my father. Now, I'm just being real. How did you feel?
Speaker 2:So, to be honest, my first and it's going to sound bad, but you got to remember I was a child. I was like six, seven, eight years old, and the first question I had and what I wanted to know did I have any siblings?
Speaker 1:Because I was the only child in the house Right and then it graduated to.
Speaker 2:I want to know who my mom is. The concept of who my dad was really didn't evolve until later on. Isn't that weird? It is. And I'm sitting here as you were talking. I was like when did I really start questioning? It was always do I have any siblings? Who's my mom?
Speaker 1:It's sad to say, but I'm sorry, but I it's and I'm. I'm at that point where if I do, I do.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:If I don't, I don't Well and it's not a negative thing.
Speaker 2:I just think that society really puts the emphasis on mothers First and foremost. Let's start there and, as I stated earlier, mother's love is unmatched. So the natural progression when you are in the unknown, you want to know where you come from. So that key is the mother, and I know. So I'll say this, I know for me, when I started the process of exploring who was my first family, exploring who was my first family, my thought process was if I can connect with mom, she'll unlock everything else I agree, I agree However and it's different in my situation.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I get bits and pieces and, I'm gonna be honest, I have bad memory. Okay, and I'm going to be honest, I have bad memory. Okay, my kids can attest to that. So I did ask a couple of times. Okay, and she gave me a name. You forgot Both times. Why didn't I just write it down? I had a phone. Why didn't I just put it in the phone? Why didn't I just write it down? I had a phone. Why didn't I just put it in the phone? So, but allegedly, as far as my bio father is concerned, he's deceased. I don't know true or not true, that is. I have taken some time to try and seek him out, but I get to, like, maybe, second cousins on both sides, like his mother's side and his father's side. I only get to second cousins.
Speaker 2:On like ancestrycom, and that's On ancestrycom and 23andMe.
Speaker 1:So again I've reached out to a few people. You know they claim they're, you know they're not giving me any information, saying they don't have information to give, they don't know. But again, I don't know. You know what? Ask me why? I don't think that they don't know.
Speaker 2:Why do you think that they don't know?
Speaker 1:No, First ask me how many siblings I have. Maybe let's start there.
Speaker 2:This is a loaded response. How many siblings do you have, Lisa?
Speaker 1:I have four that I know of. Okay, and then ask me how old the youngest sibling that I have.
Speaker 2:How old is the youngest sibling?
Speaker 1:that you have.
Speaker 2:The age of my oldest child, oh wow, 33, 34.
Speaker 1:And that age range, ooh. So in my mind Papa was a Rolling Stone. Yes, he was Right, yeah, and I'm thinking he had more than just me and her.
Speaker 2:Because it might be something that said I'm not taking the DNA because I don't want to know. So it's possible.
Speaker 1:So it's possible that they may know who this person is, or they could have been a little bit more helpful, but the type of person that they may know who this person is, or they could have been a little bit more helpful.
Speaker 2:But the type of person.
Speaker 1:He may have been Right, you know, may not be all that great, because he was out there.
Speaker 2:So that yields, though the. You know, sometimes situations happen where you are protected from stuff that you don't know. You know because it may be. You have your own buffer, so to speak, where you have filled in the narrative to protect your heart, to protect your space and your peace.
Speaker 1:And that's why I say whether I do or whether I don't.
Speaker 2:I'm okay.
Speaker 1:The only reason I would want to know more? For medical reasons. I mean, that's a big reason, but that would be it really, but that would be it really. So so far I haven't really, but I haven't gotten any further than where I've gotten and I'm not like you know. Oh my goodness, I'm not fighting to get there, I'm not. If it happens, if God sees it to happen before I leave this earth, then okay, but medical reasons would be the really the only reason I would want to know.
Speaker 2:So you talk about medical reasons. I was watching the Chi. I love that show. I just started watching it, oh, and I can't spoil it then.
Speaker 1:I can't spoil it, no, I just started watching it.
Speaker 2:So you're in season one.
Speaker 1:I'm in season four episode three. Then I'm sorry I can't give what I was going to give. But those of you all who watch it, you can.
Speaker 2:I'm not that type of person? No, I can't. If you're watching it, you know what I'm going to reference. If you watched the last episode where the child has sickle cell and they needed to find out, well, they didn't know he had sickle cell, he was sick. And when they went to the doctor, the doctor said well, I need DNA from both parents, and the guy that the young lady is with is not the father. Who's the girl? I'm not telling you that. So who she perceived to be the father was deceased and she was able to get the DNA. But then, once she got the DNA, it didn't match. Was it the person who was deceased? Was he killed? But then, once she got the DNA, it didn't match. I'm not going in.
Speaker 1:There was he killed.
Speaker 2:I don't remember, you remember, I don't remember. So yeah, I'm not telling you that, but it's a great show if you want to tune in it is.
Speaker 2:I am binging it. Yeah, it's a great show to binge. So for me, you know you talk about you don't know when I did connect with my first mother. You know, once I got over the initial shock with her, I asked. I said you know, is this person that they have in my file, my father? And she said no. I didn't tell him father, and she said no, it's a about Intel. I said, okay, is this person? Because, allegedly and she said yeah, that's it, that was your father and not having a chance to have met him, he passed away in 2013. For me not having any of the pieces of the puzzle, having now a piece of the puzzle and having to accept that this piece I would never be able to put into the puzzle, I think I just had to accept it because I wasn't going to mourn so so painfully that I would disregard this opportunity?
Speaker 2:Does that make sense? Yeah, I wish I had two hands full, but I'm going to celebrate the fact that I got one hand full and continue to move on. For medical purposes. He did like I said transition in 2013. He did like I said transition in 2013. So allegedly or potentially, I have a sister. He had another child, but on my DNA track it doesn't show anything as of yet. It's that in our culture they don't talk about stuff.
Speaker 1:It's taboo and I continue to be respectful of everybody in this journey, because it's not just me Exactly, do you question. Do you know, by any chance, what he died?
Speaker 2:from. From my understanding and your wisdom. I don't know if he fell or what happened. I think they shared with me. He rode motorcycles. He was in the military, I believe, and I may be wrong, so please forgive me, but from the information I was given I do know that he had an aneurysm. He died young too, I'm not mistaken. Don't quote me on the exact age, but it was young, considering Well yeah, I mean he was if it was in 2013,. That was what? Well, yeah, I mean he was if it was in 2013,.
Speaker 2:that was what 11 years ago. So that's in his forties. That's young. Yeah, he was, that was young.
Speaker 1:So at least you have something.
Speaker 2:I have something. I've seen the picture and I don't. I look at it. I don't think we look alike, but other people are like oh yeah, that's your dad, really Okay.
Speaker 1:Oh wow, I didn't even realize that I'm going to show you the picture.
Speaker 2:I have to show you the picture. Yeah, yeah, well, at least you have that and I think that again, when you're searching for anything, you grasp and hold on tight to every little piece that you have and you celebrate it.
Speaker 2:So, like I said, I wasn't going to rob myself of being able to celebrate. At least I know something and I can't do anything with it or I can't talk. So I'm not going to like cry over spilled milk, as they say and I hate to use that analogy, but I think for this it's relevant. I'm going to celebrate the life that I'm able to connect with relevant.
Speaker 2:I'm going to celebrate the life that I'm able to connect with. I agree, you know, I appreciate the fact of having this, this information, but now I'm going to make the most because I got to play catch up for 40 something years. I'm not having that.
Speaker 1:Because tomorrow's not promised.
Speaker 2:You ain't never lied about that.
Speaker 1:Tomorrow is not promised. So I get it, I understand, I get it, but I'm glad that you were able to have something. So again, if I do, I do, if I don't, I don't, I'm OK either way. But I think I can get some medical kind of information through 23andMe. So we'll see, we see how, what God has in store moving forward with that part of my life. But talk to me about the father who raised you. Even though he's number two, he was number one, the man.
Speaker 2:He was the man Johnny Senior. He's actually junior. I'm the third. Oh, you're the third. Right was the man Johnny Senior.
Speaker 1:He's actually junior, I'm the third, oh you're the third Right.
Speaker 2:His dad was Reverend Underwood and my dad was junior and I'm the third. So my dad was a unique man. I will honestly say that, and he made it a point to be impactful to everyone that came around him. I always made the joke. You know, he was the biggest short man I ever met Because he was only 5'2" yeah, but he controlled the room when he walked in. He was a thermostat.
Speaker 1:Because when he walked in he was a thermostat.
Speaker 2:Because when he walked in, you knew it and my mom, my mom, used to joke and say you in here strutting like you 30 feet tall, and he'd be like you know it, you know, and that's just how he carried it.
Speaker 2:He was five foot two, had a handful of diamond rings um, yeah eddie laverte and oert, and you know he did that's what they used to call him that when I was in high school. I remember his first car that I remember he had a blue Nova two-door, the seats would fold over halfway, pull out A-track, and you know he was just that guy and he used to drink pink champagne. I'm not pink. Well, my mom used to drink pink champagne.
Speaker 2:He used to drink the champagne of beers Miller High Life, so that was the first beer that I drank, because that's what my dad drank. I had a 40 ounce.
Speaker 1:Yeah, what he did. I wanted to emulate that. Yes, yes, you know, he was a a role model for me. I'll be honest, you know I understand.
Speaker 2:He was a role model for me. I'll be honest. And after my mom passed, our relationship went to a different place because at that point we became peers. I saw my father cry Two times when his dad died. We were praying, getting ready to go to the church, and his cousin was there and a few other family members and Deacon came in and they started praying. I'll never forget he turned his head and acted like he was sneezing and he was crying and I saw it and it it floored me because I had never seen that level of vulnerability. And then, you know, of course, when my mom transitioned, you know I saw him cry.
Speaker 2:My mom shared a story with me. When I was in college, I wrote my dad a letter thanking him and at the end of the letter, you know, I put I love you. You know that generation, they didn't say I love you, and I'm trying to remember it was for Father's Day, as a matter of fact. And my mom, she said I don't know what you wrote in that letter, but your dad was in there crying. He was so proud and I said well, I just shared my heart with him, right, you know? And just thinking back to monumental moments of like when I got married, when Jayla was born, when I graduated from high school, when I graduated from college, when I got licensed to preach. You know that was emotional because my mom had just passed a few months prior to so those monumental moments.
Speaker 2:Growing up, my dad was that dad to kids that fathers weren't present or that weren't as available. I remember you saying that he would drive around and pick up the kids and take them to practice. And you know he, that's just who. He was One of my friends. After the funeral he said yo. He said, man, I forgot how much your dad really did for me. And he said I always loved your family, they always embraced me, he says.
Speaker 2:But as you were given the eulogy, he said I was that kid that your dad was picking up, that your dad would say, hey, did you eat? We're all going to stop. And he said it wasn't. That he made, you know, made me feel less than I was part of the family and that's just. You know who my dad was. So I um, yeah, he was that guy, you know. And then, as time went on, you know, like I said, the relationship evolved and changed and I'm just thankful I learned a lot of lessons from from him. I learned a lot of lessons from him, like I said when I did the eulogy. The fact that he chose to give me his name, even though I was adopted, speaks volumes.
Speaker 1:It does. It definitely does, because my adoptive father did the same thing. I didn't get it, I didn't wrap my head around it. I was like, who does that?
Speaker 2:I'll tell you what's even more powerful as a black man. He gave me an 86 Cadillac Sedan DeVille that was his car my dad used to drive. After the Nova he got an Eldorado and then he got a Sedan DeVilleVille 86, brand new. I never forget brown. And when I got my license he gave me the key.
Speaker 1:And what happened to it? Did you take care?
Speaker 2:of it? No, I did not. I ran it in the ground. It was so bad. I feel so badly of what I did to that car. I used oh my goodness, this is when we used to have CDs. I would have CDs all over the car. No, wait a minute, it was cassettes back then I'd have cassettes all over it.
Speaker 1:You old enough for cassettes.
Speaker 2:Yeah, okay, let's check. Yeah, I'm old enough for cassettes. I remember the hubcaps used to come off. It was just bad. It was just bad business, but the fact that he loved me enough and then my dad retired from Philip Mars.
Speaker 2:He went to work at Lowe's OK and he bought a pickup truck and he drove that pickup truck and I drove to Carolina. Really so, as a as a son, what is that model for me? Where you make sacrifice, as my father, so that I can be comfortable. And that's what I try and do with my kids now. As long as they're good, I'm good, you're good, I don't mind. I fuss and act like I'm upset sometimes, as long as they all eat, I come and I fuss and make some noise, but at the end of the day, I'd much rather them be taken care of. That's what dads do, that's what we do, that's what we do, that's what we do I get it?
Speaker 1:My dad. My dad wasn't a fusser, but when he spoke it was like EF Hutton Everybody listened. Everybody listened Because he was a quiet man, he was a preacher.
Speaker 1:Okay, I didn't know that I'm a PK Interesting. Yes, I am a PK and my dad was. I thought he didn't. He was like the best man ever. I mean, I didn't think he did anything wrong, you know, financially anything from my perspective he did it. He's the only person I know who died being debt free. I don't know nobody else. And at that time when he passed away, he died debt free and that was mind blowing to me. He, he, he was a type of man who would. He was the protector, he was the. He made sure there was a roof over our head. He made sure that we had food. I told you, I think earlier one of the podcasts, he had a. He was a grossaholic. I call him a grossaholic. My mom was a shopaholic. He was a grossaholic, so we never went hungry Ever. There's no way we could go hungry in that house.
Speaker 1:There's food in the house all the time. All the time we would ask food Dad, can I, you know, get a dollar or something to go? No, I don't have no money, but yet anything breaks down, anything happened, anything emergency, whatever he had it, he would prioritize he knew that was the type of person he was and he was very comical.
Speaker 1:A lot of people didn't realize he was comical, but he was comical. He had a very hearty laugh, um, but he didn't say much, but he observed a lot. Like I said, I don't think he was too naive to the things, the shenanigans, that my mom would do back then.
Speaker 2:um, yes, so let me ask this tell me a funny story that you have about your dad, first one that comes to your mind.
Speaker 1:Oh wait.
Speaker 2:You can't sugarcoat it.
Speaker 1:No, I'm trying to think of one, I'm trying to think of one. All I can think of a funny story is I don't know, I think I may have already said it Every year because, like I said, my mom liked to shop. She shops all the time.
Speaker 1:Oh no, forget that one I got a better one so my dad loves pork, loves pork, so my mom and I would take trips to New York all the time. I'm from New Jersey, so going to New York was no big deal. My aunt lived in New York, her sister lived in New York, so we would go there all the time. So there's one particular time when we came back, and you know, back in the day everybody had the plastic on their furniture. So my dad and he likes I don't care what part of the pig, he loved it.
Speaker 2:From the rooter to the tooter.
Speaker 1:Yes, so he was known for his pressure cooker and pressure cooker, his pig feed and his chitlins or whatever. So we come in and we notice that there was a film On the plastic couch. I already know what is going right. So, mind you, in our house there's a wall separating the kitchen from the living room. It's the kitchen, the dining room and then the living room. All I know is something ricocheted from the kitchen into the living room. Oh my god, and it was all over the plastic furniture, the covering of the current furniture. Did he try to clean it up?
Speaker 2:he tried to clean it up. Okay, all right. Well, at least he tried to clean it up like what in the world?
Speaker 1:what happened? And it was so funny and he was trying to explain what happened and all we could do was laugh, oh my god, because he was. Oh, that's what he did. He loved food. He would take his medicine so he could eat whatever the food. You know, whatever that was, that was the funniest thing to us, because how do you get from the kitchen to the living room? Oh no, it was, and it was the chitlin one. It was everywhere, everywhere.
Speaker 1:And he he wasn't one who you know we claim my. I don't think my dad ever claimed like he didn't do that. That was not his thing. So when he's trying to all, he was just making it worse, just making it worse. It was so funny. It was all on the china, oh my god. The china cabinet all on the all on the wind, all of the things was everywhere, all in the dining room table. It was crazy. Now, that was funny and he was trying to explain himself. But he shouldn't have been eating it anyway. But he does it anyway. He don't eat it regardless, you double busted.
Speaker 2:You shouldn't be eating it and you shouldn't be cooking it Exactly, and he couldn't hide it. Because it was everywhere At that point. You can't hide it Everywhere and he couldn't hide it because it was everywhere At that point.
Speaker 1:You can't hide it Everywhere. Yeah, my dad was known for there's one lesson he did teach me. He taught me a lot of lessons.
Speaker 2:But one how to cook a good steak Medium rare.
Speaker 1:Why? Because that's the best way to eat a steak. Why? Because if you can cut it and if you don't have to add steak sauce to it, Okay.
Speaker 2:And I agree with you. I was told that you know when you cook a steak medium well or well done you cook the flavor. Yeah, my father in love, michael Bell.
Speaker 2:He is a connoisseur of many different things. He is a connoisseur of many different things and there used to be a place in Hampton where you would cook your own. There was a great steak. Yes, you remember that. Yep, you would go in and you would get your meat and then they had a big hibachi grill and you would cook it and he would educate all of us on why you would cook a steak medium. He was like it should be not blood running, but almost, and that is when you can tell if you have a great cut of meat. Yep, and I was like no dude, I needed to be cooked. I'm not trying to be chasing my food around on my plate, no. But again, as I grew and I learned, your palate changed, my palate changed.
Speaker 1:Okay, I needed just a slightly paint. Yeah, he knew his meats. That's awesome, he definitely knew his meats. I got another story.
Speaker 2:Oh, you got two Okay.
Speaker 1:So he was an electrical engineer.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:So he would come down to the shipyard on business trips quite often. He worked at the Lakehurst Naval Station as a civil servant. He was in the Navy but that was his job. So he would come down and help with the aircraft carrier. He would help do the catapults where the planes will catapult off.
Speaker 1:So I have an uncle who lives down here too. He worked in the Norfolk shipyard and he would go visit my dad. He said every time I go visit your dad he's knocked out, sleep underneath the catapult where my dad can sleep anywhere. Now, that is no DNA with us, but I can sleep anywhere For real. But he would find him knocked out, sleep Under the catapult, underneath the catapult oh my gosh, any old time. He said that I always knew where to find him. That's where he'll be asleep. I was like what, what in the world? But that's what he did. Yeah, he was something.
Speaker 1:I tell you, the thing that he really taught me was he, and I don't know if I would have gotten this in my original life. I don't think I would have been able to have a relationship with Jesus Christ if it wasn't for him. I don't think I would have why, because he's the one who introduced me to him and growing up my dad was strict when it came to church, very strict when it came to church, very strict when it came to church. So my foundation is because of him and what I built from that was because of him. I can't honestly say that I would be where I am today spiritually if it wasn't for him.
Speaker 2:Your father introduced you to the father.
Speaker 1:Yeah, look at there.
Speaker 2:Gotta preach.
Speaker 1:There's a sermon in there.
Speaker 2:There's a sermon in there. That's awesome.
Speaker 1:But yeah, if he didn't teach me anything else, that is definitely something that's good.
Speaker 2:You know, when you talk about the lessons learned, when you identify the impact that people have on you, I always say that we don't give people credit for the true impact they have on us. You can learn from people what to do and you can learn from people what not to do.
Speaker 2:You know, you, you just sit back and you watch. Um, you, you can only hide, but for so long the true you will come out. Um, and I think that you know, being in the intricate or the intimate spaces of our fathers granted us a level of access to just life and how to respond to different things. I found myself. You know, when I come home I do a lot of the things that he did just out of routine. He used to go and he would sit outside. He would have the back porch, nice with stuff. He would just sit out there with his champagne and beers and just sit out there. I'd be like, what are you doing? I'd just sit down here Enjoying nature, enjoying nature. Now I find myself on my back porch. I don't drink champagne and beers anymore. It gives me gas.
Speaker 2:My body's not wired for that.
Speaker 1:They make it differently than they did back then.
Speaker 2:It's still the champagne and beers. I don't want champagne or beer, they're over too. Just that wind down, because that's what I saw growing up. It was acceptable to do that. Like you said, my father he went to church. He worked swing shifts. It may be a scenario where he would come for the first half and then he would leave and go to work, or he would come in late because he was getting off work. My dad worked, he got off late.
Speaker 2:This is another reason why I'm a night owl, my mom would be up working and she said, as soon as that key would hit the door, I would crawl to the front door and meet him and he would pick me up. And you know, that was just that moment of connection. So I just got accustomed to staying up late, because now I'm sitting here talking about it. I think that's when Johnny Carson will come on.
Speaker 1:Johnny.
Speaker 2:Carson came on 1130. Yep, that's when Johnny Carson would come on, johnny Carson came on 1130 by the time the second or third set of commercials.
Speaker 2:That's when he would be coming home because he worked like 10 minutes from the house and it just was when he would come home. My mom would have something to eat for him and we would eat. So, again, bad habits, I know eating late, trust me, but those are traditions that, to me, build the foundation. I still say that the meal time is one of the most underrepresented times because there's so much that can be accomplished.
Speaker 1:Yes, over a meal.
Speaker 2:We are so emotionally driven when we eat that that moment of sitting around together breaking bread, that's when you come together and you identify what happened during the day, what are our plans going forward?
Speaker 2:You do a mental health check of where everybody is and we've gotten away from that because we're a microwave society. Now, instant, you know, everything is instant. Or I never forget I used to want to go eat in my room and mom was like boy, if you don't come eat at this table, I don't want to eat. I want to go get on the phone.
Speaker 1:but it was that connection yeah, we weren't allowed to do that at all trust me I couldn't eat in my room when it was dinner time.
Speaker 2:I couldn't go. I couldn't lay down during the day unless I was sick. Oh really no, she didn't play that game. Her mindset was you go to bed at night, you don't go back in your room and lay in the bed during the day.
Speaker 1:You know what I just thought about? What?
Speaker 2:Oh, here we go.
Speaker 1:You know what I'm about to say, right? I?
Speaker 2:don't know, I'm nervous. You just said that you wasn't allowed to sleep during the day in the bed, in the bed, right, I couldn't go back in my room. Oh okay, that's not counting if I fall asleep on the couch.
Speaker 1:Oh okay, I know she's trying to say I fell asleep.
Speaker 2:Just trust me, you were asleep as well. In there we are?
Speaker 1:I actually was okay, absolutely so.
Speaker 2:It just to clarify because I know somebody's like what are they talking about? We all had an opportunity where we just unplugged and got away for a moment and we were just worn out because of our lives and our routines. And we started watching the basketball game Caitlin Clark and Reese and before we knew it, the game was watching us. We were taking turns, napping, absolutely. So just to clarify that.
Speaker 1:But we got up at the right time. Well, I did the last five minutes of the game.
Speaker 2:Right, that was the most important part, so I'm going to share my funny story about my dad yes.
Speaker 2:I think I shared this on another episode. I was in the seventh grade and that is that time where I kind of started to go in a wrong direction with friends and not take my academic. You smelling yourself? I started smelling myself, okay, and the teacher I'll never forget he was an older gentleman. That's when we started switching classes and the older gentleman they reached out to my dad to kind of say hey, started switching classes. And the older gentleman they reached out to my dad to kind of say, hey, you know, your son is starting to make some wrong choices.
Speaker 2:So I walk in the science class and we had labs and in between the two labs you had another room where they stored all of the material. So I walk in class this day and I'm looking because where my seat was, and I'm like, what is that shine in that room? You have to be reminded, my dad had a handful of diamond rings. So what happened? He was in the room to watch the class, but he realized that the light from the classroom reflecting into the storage room because it was a window there. So I was like, oh, that's what we're doing today. I answered every question. I was and everybody's like the model student. Who? That is that man? I'm just sitting there. So then this guy? That's not even the funny part. The funny part is this guy comes out and act like he's Joe Clark, like he wants to put on this grandiose old show, excuse me. And he says I see why kids in here aren't learning, excuse me, getting choked up even talking about that's him getting you.
Speaker 2:Leave me alone, dude. He said I see why the schools are so messed up now. Y'all kids, y'all don't learn anything, y'all don't live like five minutes and the teacher is sitting there letting him talk. I'm like dude, control your classroom, why you letting him disrupt your class? So then at the end of it, his grand finale, I'll see you when you get home. And I'm like dude.
Speaker 2:I was good today. What are you talking about? I was bad and then I had to save face. After he left they was like, ooh, you gonna get it. I said y'all see how short he is. I knock him down. What are you talking about, Did you really? Absolutely not.
Speaker 1:You're better than that? No, no, I'm saying, did you? Oh, I know you was going to.
Speaker 2:Did I tell my friends that? Yes, absolutely, I did. I had to save face. So I get home and he's like. He said I don't see how you are able to learn in that environment. And I said, yeah, dad, it's tough. I go to school with some rough kids and you know it's tough to learn in there. Sometimes I'm so distracted. I played the role hard.
Speaker 1:I know when you are the distractor, I'm not the distractor.
Speaker 2:Define Never mind. Define distractor.
Speaker 1:Everything. Your father said that he couldn't believe you weren't able to learn in that class. Yeah, was you on any other day other than that day? And it's because of the rings is what gave you a little heads up.
Speaker 2:True.
Speaker 1:I will give you that I'm not just now meeting you. I've known you for a while.
Speaker 2:But you know what I will say this In school I was that kid that was. I learned differently and it came easy to me. Yeah, I learned differently and it came easy to me. Yeah, I was bored. So because I was bored, it's now my playground.
Speaker 2:So I yeah that was a very interesting time. I got in touch with the teacher, especially after with my history teacher, because he said I'm going to tell your father and I said I'm going to tell your father and I said I'm going to tell your father. I was like, and it feels bad because I'm an educator, so I guess it's like you reap what you sow, you reap what you sow.
Speaker 2:I was like he said you can't even get a job with Philip Morris sweeping the floor. I said well, you're here teaching. I said I'll go collect garbage and make more than you. Your mouth, my mouth was, but I was crafty with it, Right. And you still are you got to have the gift of gab? You have it and I will say something I got from my father is being able to talk, the soft skills I think are lost in this generation.
Speaker 1:Oh, absolutely. They're always down looking at something Definitely, absolutely.
Speaker 2:Wow, you know, I wasn't. I don't think I was really prepared to talk about my father.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:You know, just in sitting here reflecting, it was a block that I had put up subconsciously. You know, glad we're having this discussion because it is Father's Day and you know you talk about the role of fathers. The blessing that I have is to have my father and to have. Michael Bell in my house. You've met Michael Bell.
Speaker 1:I have met Michael Bell. He's a unique. We need to have him on in my house.
Speaker 2:You've met Michael Bell. I have met Michael Bell. He's a unique.
Speaker 1:We need to have him on here, oh wow, because he watches the podcast he does and I thank you for doing that and your comments. I appreciate them.
Speaker 2:So I think we'll bring him on because, again, non-traditional, he has a non-traditional family dynamic as well. Everybody has in some regards. So I think, again, that's what makes this so unique, this being Father's Day month. Father's Day is actually coming up on Sunday. Yes, we'll take the time to say happy Father's Day to all the fathers.
Speaker 1:Happy Father's Day to you, John.
Speaker 2:I appreciate it, thank you.
Speaker 1:You're welcome.
Speaker 2:This will be the first Father's Day that my oldest will not be with me. Really, she's going to school and they can't check out only twice during pre-college. So I said you know, it's your first weekend, I don't want you to check out, I want you to enjoy your time and I said you can FaceTime me and tell me happy Father's Day, write me a letter or something, but it's different. And now that she's graduated from high school, I see how our relationship is beginning to shift.
Speaker 1:It's going to shift, absolutely.
Speaker 2:I'm still that father, but now my responsibility has a few other characteristics to it.
Speaker 1:It changes. It definitely changes because the conversations you've had with her before, but her, her environment is going to change, so the things that affect her are going to be different than they once were when she was in high school. This is true, this is true and you just have to. It's a challenge. It's a big challenge. I know that, my husband. It's challenging for my husband when dealing with his children as adults, because you still look at them as your children as your young children.
Speaker 1:Yes, you know they suggestion or something of that nature, but you can get through it. I got no choice.
Speaker 2:No, I got another one coming. Right, you got another one coming.
Speaker 1:But it's going to be OK and I want to wish my husband, titus, a very happy Father's Day. Absolutely, my guy, yes, so he's been a great dad. Absolutely, I wouldn't have it any other way for him to be my baby daddy.
Speaker 2:I have, you know, privilege to have a lot of people in the village Um and you know Titus is one of the people and just to watch his example because, you know you, all's children are older. So I've, I've sat back from the time that my kids were very, very small and just watched how the potential future could look. So I've drawn many, many, many lessons from you know just his interactions, his modeling, what he says and what he doesn't say in that thing.
Speaker 2:So I want to kind of land the plane on this. With it being Father's Day, I want to encourage the fathers first and foremost. You know, don't take for granted, just because you hold the title, the impact that you have If you are granted the opportunity. Try and have a positive impact. You know there are many dynamics that lead to various situations. I'm not speaking to those. I'm speaking when you do have the impact. I mean the opportunity to spend some time and let it happen organically, even if it hasn't been there previously. If you're watching this, it's for a reason. Take the opportunity to try and make a connection, to try and impact somebody in a positive manner. We talk about generational purchase. We talk about things that are passed down over the years. Be the change, yeah.
Speaker 2:You know that's the if I can impress upon you one thing be the change, because society will have you believe that fathers are not present and I will tell you that we are present and accounted for. Are there some that aren't in the lives? Yes, there may be variables that are unknown of why that happens. But if you have the opportunity to to reconcile, if you have the opportunity for, you know, reconnection, don't close the door on it Because you know, like we've shared the positive memories of, you know, our fathers. You know there is a I don't want to say it's not a lack, but there is a awareness of unknown for lack of better words. Yeah, you know, and how that impacts other people is very different, you know but the I'm sorry, but the mothers also have a pivotal position in that.
Speaker 2:Can you speak on that?
Speaker 1:I mean I, you, you have to allow the father to be a father. You know you really do sometimes. Yet you and him may not have a great relationship, but that still doesn't negate the fact that that is that father's, that child's father. And you have to come to some type of an understanding, an agreement, to agree to disagree for the benefit of the child. So, because you hear it all the time oh, the mom talks down about the father or the mom won't allow the father to see the child for stupid reasons. You know, if it's child support, then Take them to court, do whatever you need to do legally that allow them to see their child, because it's important that they see a father, because they're always saying the father's not there, the father's not there, but it's not always because of the father, it's because of the mother. I'm not going down on mothers, but you play a pivotal role in that.
Speaker 2:You have to help with that relationship, what I say when I do counseling or just have conversations, mentoring, I say one remember that the child didn't ask to be brought in this world Exactly. As adults, you chose to make some adult decisions. Be adults in your conversations. I encourage the mother and the father. Don't talk down about the other. If that person is who they are, the child will see it when the time is up, Exactly, Let them make that decision. Don't give your narrative because your narrative is situational. The experience or the interaction may be different from what you had. So, if anything that we can do to encourage, I hope you take that nugget and make the best of the situation.
Speaker 1:Because fathers are important.
Speaker 2:Absolutely Fathers matter.
Speaker 1:Fathers matter.
Speaker 2:Fathers matter as we sign off for Father's Day 2024, our Father's Day episode. I'm John.
Speaker 1:And I'm Lisa.
Speaker 2:We are adopted. Thank y'all.
Speaker 1:Until next time.
Speaker 2:Until next time, until the next episode. Thank you for listening to the so I'm Adopted podcast. We hope that this was informative and educational. You can follow us on Instagram and Facebook at so I'm Adopted. Also, subscribe to our YouTube channel so I'm Adopted. And again, thank you for listening and until next time time, make the choice to begin your healing journey.
