So.... I'm Adopted Podcast!
This podcast creates a space for genuine conversations about adoption, where emotions are acknowledged, journeys are reconciled, and a healthy acceptance of truths is fostered. Delve into the impact of adoption on all parties involved, gaining insights from adoptees, adoptive parents, biological parents, as well as professional psychologists and social workers. Explore the realities, reconciliation processes, and ongoing dynamics of adoption.
So.... I'm Adopted Podcast!
Mother's Day: Reflecting on Mothers Chosen and Given
As we approach Mother's Day, Lisa and I find ourselves wrapped in the warmth of gratitude for the incredible women who raised us—our adoptive mothers. Their love and influence run deep, and in this heartfelt episode, we examine the layered emotions adoptees may experience during this time. From the personal tales of country music's Faith Hill to the surprising family discovery of Jack Nicholson, we thread stories of identity, reunion, and the complex tapestry of family dynamics woven by both birth and adoptive parents.
During our conversation John is sharing how reuniting with his biological mother brought new dimensions to his life. Together, we navigate the bittersweet terrain of Mother's Day, discussing how it can be both a celebration and a moment of reflection for those with intricate family relationships. We consider the balance of honoring all parental figures and reveal personal coping mechanisms that help manage the holiday's emotional triggers, offering solace and understanding to anyone finding their way through the joys and pangs of such occasions.
Encircling the theme of maternal love, we reminisce on cherished memories—from the simplicity of Southern wit to the profound impact of shared wisdom. Our hosts stories create a vibrant mosaic of family life, illustrating how moments of humor and humanity bind us to our loved ones. These narratives underscore the beauty of nurture over nature and how the essence of family can transcend traditional boundaries. Join us for an honest and touching exploration that celebrates the indelible mark of mothers, both given and chosen, and the lifetime of memories they gift us.
Music by Curtis Rodgers IG @itsjustcurtis
Produce and Edited by Lisa Sapp
Executive Producer Lisa Sapp
Executive Producer Johnnie Underwood
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Welcome to the so I'm Adopted podcast, where we talk everything adoption. This journey is not one we take alone. Together we grapple with raw emotions that surface from adoption stories. We want you to be comfortable enough to heal, so sit back and go with us on this journey as we dive deep into adoption.
Speaker 1:We wanted to create a space for adoption truth. We have a common bond of being adopted. Our stories are very, very different. We wanted to have our conversations and allow other people to hear our conversations and also be able to share theirs as well.
Speaker 2:You know, this podcast is where we will hear our adoption stories from other adoptees, adoptive parents and biological families. We will also have input from licensed professionals such as psychologists, social workers, to get a deeper understanding of this adoption journey. Hopefully, these stories and perspectives will give hope and understanding and courage to those who are adopted or who are thinking about. You know, being adopted, along with the journey of acceptance, reconciliation and maintenance of being adopted, you know those are going to be some of the anchors that we will highlight each time we come on this podcast.
Speaker 1:Welcome to another episode of.
Speaker 2:So I'm.
Speaker 1:Adopted. I'm Lisa, I'm John and we are both adopted. So on this episode, we're going to kind of celebrate our mothers, because this Mother's Day is this weekend. This Mother's Day is this weekend and we want to take a little time to talk about the two most important people in our lives, right yeah?
Speaker 2:I got to be careful how I say that, because I'm married, I got girls.
Speaker 1:You got to be specific, well you know what I mean the two most important mothers Right.
Speaker 2:Mothers do hold a special place. Yes, you just got to make sure we pinpoint that, because my wife is a mother as well.
Speaker 1:You're right, the ones that made us who we are today there you go, that's perfect. But, yes, the most, the two most important people. As far as For who?
Speaker 2:we are today. We're going to try and just celebrate them a little bit today and hopefully it will inspire you wherever you are in your journey, and again, this is about nontraditional relationships. Hopefully this will inspire those who are struggling with their relationship with their mothers as much as the cards will be all over the drugstore, because, come Father's Day they have one small section, mother's Day they take out the whole sidewall just to put up cards. It's true, you're right, but hopefully this will inspire you to reflect on the relationship that you have with your mother, whether it is your first mom I'm using the language from before or your adopted mom, or the non-traditional individual who is nurturing you. So that is our desire for this one, and we're going to jump right in. And we started something on our last podcast where we brought light to famous adopted individuals. So, lisa, who do you have this week?
Speaker 1:So this week I have Faith Hill, the country singer, okay, and her story is, you know she's married to Tim McGraw, he's also a country singer. But before I talk about them, interesting how they ended up being together. No-transcript. She had a loving family, you know. She was raised in a great family, loving, warm, comforting, just like us, so it wasn't like she was missing anything other than who she was. So she, like for us, was kind of figuring out well, who are we right? So she did eventually find out about her biological family. Her adoptive parents told her that it was an affair so they had to give her up. But he found out that that wasn't true.
Speaker 2:So why would they say it was an affair?
Speaker 1:I tried to figure that out, I tried to find something on it, but to find out they were married. Her biological parents were married and they had a son younger than her.
Speaker 2:Did they keep the son?
Speaker 1:They kept the son. But I tried to find out information of you know why did her biological family, you know, give her up and keep him? But I wasn't able to find anything in regards to that. But she doesn't. She speaks a lot about publicly, about her adoption and all that, so she talks about, but she never really spoke about why they gave her up for adoption. So it's interesting to know if they were married, why would you give her up, unless, I mean they know if they were married, what? Why would you give her up, unless I mean they unless they were really struggling and destitute, to where they couldn't, you know, raise it, raise a child, depending on how old they were when they got married, correct, you know, financially they may not, may not have been able to do it, I don't know, but she doesn't speak about it.
Speaker 2:Anyway, I want to listen to some of her music now to see if it is embedded in the songs. Could be Because we talk about how indirectly adoption impacts people, yes, people, and I would believe that, because that is her gift, that at least one one of her songs, or probably bits and pieces, like I said, sprinkled around.
Speaker 1:So yeah, I'm going to have to research that one.
Speaker 1:But she did get her artistic gene from her mother. Her mother was art, so that's where she got her artsy from. Because of that, now, growing up, you know, once she found her biological mother. Unfortunately, she passed in 2007. But she really didn't have a deep, deep relationship with her, unfortunately. But she did appreciate that her mother felt that it was best to give her up so she can have a better chance at life. So, based off of that and that's kind of what she's been saying out in the public when she does interviews so it may have been a financial situation just based off of her saying that, you know, she felt that her mom wanted her to have a better chance at life. Wow, you know what I'm saying. So to me, that's the first thing that comes in my mind. Better chance of life is financial, maybe.
Speaker 2:Potentially so.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, so you know, she marries Tim McGraw and Tim McGraw I don't know if you know he wasn't adopted, but his real biological father was Tug McGraw, the baseball player. You remember him? I don't. No, I forgot. You're young, I'm a youngin, you're youngin. But yes, his father was, and I, I think he found him, found out maybe I didn't do too much of a deep dive on him because I've heard the story before, but I think he maybe was in his teenage years or something of that nature that he found out that that was his father. So he wasn't raised with his father, wow, but it was interesting how these two people with these you know, they're not the same, but they can understand each other's plight.
Speaker 2:Non-traditional relationship.
Speaker 1:Non-traditional relationship. That's amazing and you know they've been married forever. So that's my famous person person, okay, faith hill so mine is a bit of a shocker okay so I'm gonna give you the the build-up right.
Speaker 2:Okay, because this individual didn't find out until he was 37 years old oh, like he found out in 1974. Time Magazine and researchers. They learned that Jack Nicholson, who was my individual. He grew up thinking that his mother was his sister and his grandmother was his mother.
Speaker 1:That sounds like a Tyler Perry movie.
Speaker 2:But he didn't find out until 74. Both his sister and his mother and grandmother had passed away. Oh wow, his one died in 1963 and the other one died in 1970.
Speaker 1:So he was young.
Speaker 2:He was 37.
Speaker 1:He was 37. So he was already famous or well-known at the time.
Speaker 2:At that point, yeah, I think he had some notoriety when he was already famous or well-known at the time. At that point, yeah, I think he had some notoriety when he was already probably doing things. But you know to have that dropped on you and the individuals aren't there anymore. How do you navigate that space, how do you wrap your mind around that when you've been in the space with the individual, but now does that change the conversations that you had with your sister, that you had with your mom?
Speaker 2:Exactly but then how does your mom respond, knowing that this is my yes? Wow that is an interesting dynamic to be able to keep that facade going in the house.
Speaker 1:But the thing is he he's never gotten reconciliation, I'm sure.
Speaker 2:Well, you don't know, Reconciliation may come in different forms. I mean, he may be at peace with. Maybe he saw something growing up that he's like I'm glad that my grandmother raised me. You know, we just don't know. Yeah, yeah. Or think about it like this and this is where I say it impacts everyone differently Maybe that is one of the things that helps him play these various roles that he's able to go into a different space because maybe he created different dynamics? Yes, you know. So everything has a a purpose.
Speaker 2:Everything has a purpose. So that's, that's my celebrity. Okay, so Jack Nicholson never knew, uh, but again, recognizing his gift in the field and how he's able to just co-switch and go back and forth excellent, excellent oh excellent. But you know, a lot of times they say your comedians and actors and actresses are the ones that have the most pain because they're able to go deep. Yes, into being away from everything else, yes, so yes, I don't know.
Speaker 1:You're right, that's good.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so good research Good research.
Speaker 1:I'm going to top that. All right, I got a couple in my pocket.
Speaker 2:So let's jump in first. Happy Mother's Day. It is upcoming this week. It is. It is we were preparing for the episode and we talked about this year how do we address Mother's Day. We've been talking about mothers this whole podcast series and it would be only right to acknowledge mothers and have some dialogue on the backstories behind Mother's Day. Again, like I stated earlier, as much as we celebrate it, for some people it is challenging, yes, you know. So we want to make sure that we create a space for those who have various emotions for this upcoming week, space for those who have various emotions for this upcoming week. I can tell you that I, after my mom passed, I didn't really know how to feel Mother's Day coming up, and then last year, after having met my biological mom, I still didn't know how to feel, you know. So it was all of the different emotions there was happiness, there was sadness there was confusion, so I'll get into that later.
Speaker 2:But you know, not knowing where people are on their journey, we just encourage you to do an assessment of where you are.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's. It is challenging. I know, when my adoptive mother passed, I used to avoid Mother's Day to the point, not for myself, on that, on that, you know, if you lost your mother or whatever, and you know we would do little circles and everybody you know start talking about their feelings and you know how they, you know, love their mom and things of that nature. I just didn't want to go there. So I just stopped going to church on Mother's Day for a period of time and then that was really challenging for years for me. I just stopped.
Speaker 2:So let me ask this question Did you tell the kids why you stopped going, or even your husband? Or did you create excuses where? Oh, I just want to do this because it's my day and not go.
Speaker 1:Yeah, pretty much. I don't recall telling them why. I just said oh, like you said, it's my day and I can do what I want it, and that's my business.
Speaker 2:Again, we cope. Yeah, that's a way of coping. Yeah, and that's my business. There it is.
Speaker 1:Again, we cope, that's a way of coping, yeah, but it was a challenge, it was too much and it just kept opening up, reopening the wound, reopening the wound. But when I found my biological mother I got maybe a sense of of renewal for the day. But again it was weird because, honestly, it took me forever to try to find a car, because you know all the cars are, you know how you nurtured me, you know you've always been there. You know it was hard.
Speaker 1:Maybe we need to start a car business maybe it was just difficult to find that right car, because I can't say all this stuff because you didn't, you wasn't there for that right, but I appreciate you being my mother would acknowledge they acknowledged that. But it was tough. It was tough, it was hard to find something that suits that particular occasion with my biological mother. Wow, yeah, because you just it took a minute. I mean I'm standing in the car store, I mean I'm struggling.
Speaker 2:It took me a minute. I'm surprised you didn't walk out, because I can imagine that would be frustrating, and you just give up.
Speaker 1:I didn't. But I mean I tried to find the most simple generic, but you know that didn't waver you one way or the other. It took a minute, but I found it was weird.
Speaker 2:it was weird and I asked you earlier did you let your kids or your husband know in that transition of, like you said, finding, and then, with Mother's Day, did you sacrifice your Mother's Day for the benefit of the memories or the connections?
Speaker 1:or anything. No, just going to church. Okay, because then, yeah, just that. Going to church, because I knew it was going to go to the same path of you have to talk about your mother and opening that womb, just that. But afterwards, yeah, we did our regular. You know, whatever they were going to do for me, you know, cook dinner and give my little cards and gifts and all that stuff. So all that went fine, I'm okay with that. Okay, I'm fine, I was fine with that. It was just that.
Speaker 2:Gotcha no-transcript moms come up and I remember watching. I don't have any type of capacity to think about that. How would I respond? And then, after my adopted mom passed, I remember dreading but not knowing how I would handle it. Do I need to? I remember the whole week before on Facebook creating posts because I felt like I needed to let the world know that she's still in my heart, she's still here, this and that, and it became to a point that it was more about me than her memory, because it was therapeutic for me. We went to church and I lost it. It was tough, but again I made the excuse that, oh, I needed to do that. As time went on, what I recognized was there's no blueprint for grieving. My situation and scenario was different from everybody else's and as long as I was whole with what was going on, that's what was important with what was going on.
Speaker 2:That's what was important, and what I couldn't do was rob my wife of being celebrated for Mother's Day Absolutely yeah. Nor did I want to rob my two girls of being able to celebrate their mother.
Speaker 1:But did Janice understand how you were feeling and did she give you the space to do that? She?
Speaker 2:definitely gave me the space. I can't say that she understood, and the reason I say that is because it's tough to understand when you haven't walked that path. Once her mom did pass, we had a common understanding and you know she wrestled. And because I had already walked that path, I gave her the space and I would ask you know, what do you want it to look like? What do you need? Almost putting you know what I thought I needed for that day to the side, because it was fresher for her, because it had just taken place. Right, I had already started the journey. So I didn't, I tried not to need as much and it just, you know, we just played off of each other where I would draw strength from her. So, but then last year, for me, having connected with my first mom, I would say, yes, it was, it was still fresh, because we had just connected in February, I wanted to do everything. What do I send this morning? How do I? I remember she told me just be patient, just calm down, let it happen naturally and organically.
Speaker 2:Once that plane landed, it was you know what I'm going to celebrate her, and I remember I started calling my adopted mom by her first name in a conversation that I was having with my first mom and she asked me. She said why do you call her by that? And I said, well, you are my first mom, and I used that language. And she said okay, I just want to make sure that you're okay with it. And I said, well, you are my first mom and I used that language. And she said OK, I just want to make sure that you're OK with it. And I said, well, I grew up having four sets of grandparents. My mom had multiple moms because she was raised by her aunt, so it wasn't foreign for me to have two mothers.
Speaker 1:OK.
Speaker 2:So, but it was interesting that she stopped me and said you know why are you calling her Carla and not mom?
Speaker 1:And.
Speaker 2:I said well, she's still mom. I said you're mom. I said between the two of you, you raised a great man, yeah, that's right, they did. I appreciate that they did.
Speaker 1:I appreciate that I can attest to that. Thank you, yes. I appreciate that they did. I appreciate that I can attest to that. Thank you, yes.
Speaker 2:So let me ask you this what is your favorite memory of your mother?
Speaker 1:My favorite memory of my mom is how she cared for so many people in our family, in our church and in our community, selfishly, and always was there. So I've mentioned before that she was a band parent, she was a PTA president. She was always in the school system doing things for us and for other people my teachers, my coaches. It was nothing for my mom to cook something special for someone at the school or even someone in our neighborhood it was. That's the memory that I have of her her doing for someone else, her serving someone else, her giving of her time for someone else. That's what she did, and I enjoy serving others because of what I the example that I saw in front of me Gotcha Okay. So look, I'm not going to cry today because I'm trying not to cry today.
Speaker 1:There's nothing wrong with crying I know, but I didn't want to cry today. It's therapeutic, but, yes, that's the example that she set before me to serve others was amazing, amazing, I mean, just yeah, that's, that's the memory.
Speaker 2:Awesome, awesome, wow, wow. So if I had to try and pinpoint a favorite memory and parallel to like you were sharing, my mom was that community mom where she you know she cooked and did everything for everybody. I'm going to go with a internal memory inside the house, my mom would, at night, read the green section of the newspaper.
Speaker 1:The green section yeah, what is that?
Speaker 2:It's the greens. I never read it, but it was a part of the newspaper that was the green section.
Speaker 1:I don't know what was in it, but she would always read the green section. I'm from New Jersey. We didn't have a green section. I don't know what that is the Richmond Times.
Speaker 2:Dispatch. They had a green section. If you're from Richmond, type in. I'll Google it, We'll figure it out.
Speaker 2:She would be rolling her hair. She had the old school foam rollers the pink ones, that's right and the papers and all of that good stuff, and she had a glass of bourbon and she had a cigarette. And I would crawl into the bed even as a elementary school, middle school and I would be at the foot of the bed while she was doing this, and it would be late at night because she was self-employed, so she would work late, so it'd be about 1130. And she would sit there with a cigarette roll in her head with a drink. And now that I think about it, it takes skills to do all three at the same time.
Speaker 1:I was about to say that. I said she's talented. She worked with her hands.
Speaker 2:That was her thing, and that was her thing, and we would have conversations about life and at the moment I didn't recognize how much of a gift it was, but it was so many life lessons that were passed down, so much so that when Janice and I started dating and got married, my mom she didn't drink at that time and she didn't smoke, but she would still be in there and her hair had thinned a little bit so she didn't roll it, but she would still be in there reading the paper, have the TV on at Janice. I remember she was sitting, it was a chair in her room and we have that chair in our bedroom now and she would just have conversations. So that was that moment of transferring of stories in life. Um, so I think now that's where my gift of gab comes from because I would just sit there at her feet and ask questions.
Speaker 2:And she would ask me questions and she would always say you can ask me anything that you want In life. You're going to make mistakes. Just don't make the same mistake twice.
Speaker 1:That's good, that was good my mom was full of wisdom. That's good. That just brought back a memory for me too. My mom knew everyone's story. I mean she could talk about someone's. It's funny that she knew everyone's story but never said her story.
Speaker 2:Maybe that's why she knew everybody else's to keep the conversation going and to keep you intrigued about, but never said her story. Maybe that's why she knew everybody else's to keep the conversation going and to keep you intrigued about everybody else Telling you everything. And this is again the behavioral hat that. I'm wearing of the motivation of the why. That may have been her indirect why, but not having the language to communicate.
Speaker 1:I just thought about that. I mean juicy stories too. I'm telling you juicy stories oh my goodness what but she never talked about her story.
Speaker 2:Time to think about it.
Speaker 1:Hmm, hmm, wow.
Speaker 2:So I think I know the answer to the next question. I think you shared a little bit of it, but what did you admire most Much?
Speaker 1:more. That's what I admired about her was how she was a servant to to others, Um, and, and it didn't matter to others and it didn't matter to her. I mean my. So my dad had a. He was a shopaholic when it comes to groceries. Really, yes, Trust me, we could have.
Speaker 1:Like hoarding, if you want to call it that. Okay, but it was grocery. So my mom, like I said, she she was known for cooking and it did it was. It was easy for her to just go and get chicken out the freezer because it was always food in there, because he always went grocery shopping and she would cook, take it to whoever you know. It didn't matter who it was, she was known for doing that. We had this one lady that was in the church that I grew up in. My mom would make this dish chicken and mushroom dish right. She called it the healing chicken Because anytime she got sick my mom would make that for her and she would be better. She would call it the healing chicken. I was like, okay, but she always called it that you know, and that's who my mom was.
Speaker 1:It was nothing for my mom to have something in the car going to someone's house to give it to them, didn't matter Clothes. Another example my god sister was getting married. Her mom had died years, years earlier and my mom went to work. My mom was a you know homemaker, so she was always at home. She didn't have to work. She only worked when she had a purpose to work and this one day she she started to work at Johnson and Johnson with the baby wipes were just coming out during that time. So she was working at Johnson and Johnson with the baby wipes and she made money to help pay for majority of her wedding, because it was just her. You know her father of her wedding, because it was just her father and, mind you, anybody who knew my mom didn't have to worry about any baby wipes.
Speaker 1:She took care of them During that time frame. But when I had kids, that shit had sailed years earlier, because you didn't need it.
Speaker 2:You already could.
Speaker 1:I was like when I say anybody had kids during that time frame I think it was like the early 80s During the 80s.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:And you knew my mother.
Speaker 2:You were good.
Speaker 1:You were good. You would never have to pay for a baby wife. Back then, I think they had just come out with baby wives. Baby wives are expensive, exactly so that was like the hot thing Disposable. You know there was disposable baby wives and you know, I'm telling you, that's just who she was. That's awesome. That's just who she was and that's what I admired about her. Because she was so given to others, it didn't matter, I never met her because she was so given to others, it didn't matter.
Speaker 2:I never met her, but I can see that in you, just how you are, you pay attention to details and it's not always out in the front, but it's the nurturing piece that it comes across in it.
Speaker 1:so I definitely see that that character, and that's something that I was. Obviously it wasn't in my gene. I was taught that, yeah now there's a lot of things native. Yes, there's a lot of, a lot of things that are in my genes that I didn't realize until after I met my biological mother. That's why I do that.
Speaker 2:It's interesting you say that had an opportunity to sit down with my first mom and again, because I had not seen her and we're just getting to know each other and I'm just sitting there, know each other, and I'm just sitting there looking at her and I'm just like stuck looking at her face and she said what baby? And I said I'm, I just can't stop looking at you. And then we started doing something and she did something and I was like whoa, and it was like stuff that I do, and we started talking about different things and we like Reese's Cups and I was like that's my guilty pleasure, you know just little things like that, yes, just like grab on to.
Speaker 2:But the mannerism was the hands, the sense of humor, the bluntness. I don't think I'm blunt like that, but my kids say I am. But as I'm having conversations with her and we're starting to, you know, just be more transparent, I'm seeing like, wow, here it is Not being in the presence of her growing up. Undeniably, that's a blueprint for me.
Speaker 2:You know that's. That's a live blueprint. That that's a live blueprint that I'm sitting here looking at. It doesn't take away from Carolyn, who raised me and shaped it. But that piece of clay that Carolyn shaped came from mom. You know what I'm saying. You can't take that away.
Speaker 1:You can't take it away. It's crazy because now with my and I keep saying biological I said I'm going to start using first family, first family.
Speaker 1:First family. When, like my niece, when I talked to her on the phone, she's like, oh my gosh, you sound just like granny. Gosh, you sound just like granny. I mean for me to have so many different mannerisms and the things that I do. It's like this person that I didn't know all that time. We both enjoy doing solitaire together. I mean, I enjoy solitaire. I do it on my phone all the time. It's a little thing about me, and that was one of her things.
Speaker 2:Share a funny story about mom.
Speaker 1:Which one Either one you pick about my adoptive mom. So growing up we lived in a household. My father was. We grew up in holiness.
Speaker 2:Wait a minute. You got to explain what that means. Everybody might not know.
Speaker 1:Everybody might not know. So they were very holiness. Is that? You, you know you're really strict in the biblical words of Old Testament. You, you know you're really strict in the biblical words of Old Testament. So, you know, I couldn't go to the movies. I couldn't. Did you have to wear a hat when I was in church? Skirt all the way down.
Speaker 1:I didn't wear pants. I you know all that stuff. I technically couldn't go to the prom, and that's the funny thing. So, skating any, all this stuff that we couldn't do worldly, no, none of that was something that we could do. You know, makeup, earrings, all that. But because of where my mom, well, how my mom was raised, she again, she was from the West Indies, so she was raised Catholic. So, you know, as far as you know she, you know she switched from being Catholic to being a Christian and once she got married to my father okay, okay, right. So the funny thing is is that's how he was raised, but she wasn't raised that way. So when certain things happen let's say my prom she would like tell him to like go to the grocery store and I'll get dressed and we'll take pictures, and you know and do the whole store and I'll get dressed and we'll take pictures and you know and do the whole thing.
Speaker 1:So he wasn't there, but I don't think he was that naive.
Speaker 2:I was about to say he didn't know, like when he came back, what did you do? I was gone already, oh okay. And he didn't ask hey, where?
Speaker 1:is she? No, yeah, I just think you know, and she would always do things of that nature. We would. I would go skating. So anytime that I was with my dad I had to wear a skirt. I don't care if we went down to the 7-Eleven, but in New Jersey back then was Cumberland Farm. Y'all know that. For those who live in, New Jersey.
Speaker 2:That's the corner store.
Speaker 1:That's like a 7-Eleven.
Speaker 2:That's the bodega.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:I know the language.
Speaker 1:So we will go anywhere. I would always have to wear dresses, but with her for school or playing outside, I can wear pants. That was just a thing. So I think what I enjoyed well, I guess because I was reaping the benefits of it was how she was trying to navigate around my father and I just thought that was like the coolest thing to do, because she would I'm thinking she's sneaking, right, you know what I I'm saying. So, from a child's perspective, I just thought it was cool how she would, you know, and he would go and he would leave and he would take pictures. My, my prom date came and you know, all day too.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh could I have it?
Speaker 2:I'm not, I'm just saying no, no, think about it. You paint a picture that you're sneaking to even go, you're sneaking to take pictures. So I just wasn't even. I was thinking you just hurry up and get out.
Speaker 1:Oh, nah, nah, no, no, we didn't rush.
Speaker 2:Push the envelope.
Speaker 1:No, we didn't rush.
Speaker 2:Well, I guess because he went to go get my hair done.
Speaker 1:I went to Philly to get my hair done for the prom. I drove to Philly to get my hair done. He just never questioned anything, it just happened. I just thought that was like wow.
Speaker 2:I have to believe that they had some type of conversation?
Speaker 1:I think they did. They had to, as as I'm an adult.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:But then I just thought it was you just went reaping the benefits. I was just reaping the benefits, Got it From it all you know, because that's what's who she was.
Speaker 2:That's awesome.
Speaker 1:That's what's who she was. That's awesome. And then another thing I what cracked me up was when she would talk to my I know, my, my family's gonna be like really, but it's true, you know they would. Her my aunt would be on the phone talking and really with anybody, and I knew how she was and she would the way. She would just handle her on the phone and then she'll get up and just say you know what I'm? I just told her that just so she would get off my back. And I thought that was the funniest thing. Because later on we had the conversation. She was like, no, she would do. I said I was on the other end of the line. She would do. I said I was on the other end of the line, so I know what actually took place, right, but she always had she can cuss you out without using the cuss word and you be like did I just get cussed out? Yeah, did she just cuss me out? And then people's like what did she? Because she was from West Indy.
Speaker 2:Oh, okay, when she got upset.
Speaker 1:When she got upset, the dialogue was thick. I didn't I. She sounded American to me. Because, I was there all the time but people were like, wait a minute, wait a minute, did she? Just? I thought those were comical times. But no one messed with her, especially when she had a knife in her hand, because she would always go don't play with me, because she's always cooking, so she was always cutting something up. So you never messed with her when she was in the kitchen.
Speaker 2:Gotcha.
Speaker 1:That? Yeah, you didn't do that. She always had a was in the kitchen, gotcha? That mm-mm? Yeah, you didn't do that. She always had a knife in her hand, because she was always cutting something up and she would always talk like this Wow, so play with her if you want to? Yeah, don't play with her, but she and all that again, she was a giver, she was a giver, she was a giver. She gave whatever she had and she was there for whomever.
Speaker 2:That's a life lesson.
Speaker 1:If I could be just an ounce of who she was. I think you are, I think you have. I'm a better woman.
Speaker 2:But here I'm gonna take it a step further. I'm gonna tell you why. I know that you are because it is in your children, so it's been passed down. What she did you do modeled, and now your kids do it. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I've seen them do it, you know, so you don't have to guess whether that's something that you do. You've done it, you still do it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Well, thank you, I appreciate you seeing that in me and and my and my children. I appreciate that. I appreciate you seeing that in me and in my children. I appreciate that. I appreciate the sapettes yeah, they're pretty special. I agree, they're pretty special. I tried. So tell me this what do you miss about your mom?
Speaker 2:What do you miss about your mom? What do I miss? No-transcript, and I say phone conversations because when I got older you know I would be here and she would be in Richmond.
Speaker 2:And our conversations, just like anything else, evolved. So me growing up, it started, like I said, sitting at the foot of the bed and just getting life lessons and then, when I got to college, it was her living vicariously through me, and it was so and again, now reflecting back, she had the gift of gab to be able to pull certain things out, so she would make it seem like she had no clue what was going on and she was so excited to hear what I was doing and I was excited to tell her. And I was excited to tell her. I'll never forget Janice and I started dating and I called and said Mom, you know, I think I found somebody I'm interested in and she was like well about time.
Speaker 2:I said, well. She said, well, tell me about it. And I started telling her about it. She was like, oh, okay. And as I continued to talk, she was like well, when do I get to meet her? And I said, well, I don't know. This so happened. She ended up meeting her the next week. We went on with the church, my aunt was giving her initial sermon and after we met and she met Janice, and then we talked the next day, she said I like that girl, you're going to be all right. And I said, well, I think I'm a good catch too. She was like, yeah, well, that's not important. She would have these ways of humbling you. The other thing I miss about her, and it's twofold, my mom had these one-liners these sayings that she got from the South.
Speaker 2:My mom was from a place called Margaret Alabama. Her dad was from Youngstown. Okay, my mom was from Detroit.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:So she had the combination of just life. So she would have these sayings that just in the moment it didn't make any sense. She would say if something was going on and it didn't make sense, she would say something in the milk ain't white.
Speaker 1:What did that mean?
Speaker 2:That means there's something wrong If you get milk.
Speaker 1:that's not white, you ain't going to drink it. That's true. She would say, and this Well, that's true.
Speaker 2:That's true. You know, she would say, and this was something that I adopted and it sounds harsh and I heard her say it and it was so I don't even know if I should say it, but that's who she was. And if you knew my mom, you've heard her say that. Hopefully she didn't say it about you, but I'm gonna tell you, people would like and my mom was giving, so she would endure a lot. But when she got to that point, when she had enough and she would say you can get your ass to jesus, because I'm through with you I know that's right and think about it.
Speaker 2:It as an elementary school kid you hear your mom say that it's like, yeah, I don't know what it means, but yeah, sound good. And she would say it and she wouldn't blink her eye and I mean she just was like there's a book I don't know who has it now, but just of Carolyn saying Mmm, yeah, it was a book.
Speaker 1:he had to be really done with you to say that, oh what?
Speaker 2:done and I will say I heard her say it three times and all three of those individuals never dotted the dough of 3000 glenn and drive again. She was adamant about it wow she didn't play um, so she was done done she was done, well done wow, yeah, um, that's a final statement.
Speaker 1:when it comes to that's a drop the mic man, what?
Speaker 2:How do you respond to?
Speaker 1:that you can't, you don't grace that door ever again.
Speaker 2:And my mom you know she grew up like I said. She used to work for five hours a day cleaning houses. Okay, so her mindset was she didn't grow up with a lot of money. So when she got to a point that she became an adult and, like I said, she was self-employed and she was making good money, so she went to, we went on cruises, she went to London. She had this jelly bean story that she would tell and it was a reflection of just her working for five hours a day. She would work for the well-to-do white folks. She was worked for the well-to-do white folks and she said she was cleaning the house one day and the lady had some jelly beans my mom's cleaning and she saw them and the lady was like you want some of these jelly beans?
Speaker 2:And my mom was like no, thank you, you know, very humble, but she said deep down she wanted them. So she said, you know, a week went by and the next week when she came in, when she got ready to leave, the lady gave her a little bag and said I want to give you these. And I was like no, no, thank you. She says no, I saw you looking up and I want to be a blessing to you. And she said that's where she first learned the blessing of giving somebody something. She said because that jelly bean meant the world to her.
Speaker 2:She said she didn't eat it because she couldn't afford to get no other ones, but it helped her understand that you know what To do something nice for somebody goes a long way, goes a long way.
Speaker 1:You never want to take away someone else's blessing.
Speaker 2:Right, right, absolutely.
Speaker 1:I did learn that from my mother. When someone wants to bless you, don't say no, give it to them because that's what they want to do as a blessing.
Speaker 2:So I'll tell you a memory that I have of my first mom. So it was my dad, my doctor. Dad died in February of last year, so my birthday is February 24th. That morning about five o'clock, I got a text from her. Now, mind you, we hadn't talked a whole lot, I had just met her for the first time. I didn't even realize I'd met her at the film. But when I got the text it I'm not going to say solidified all of my questions, but I had this feeling of validation because for 40 plus years I always wondered did she remember my birthday?
Speaker 1:Because for 40 plus years. I always wondered did she remember my birthday?
Speaker 2:And I asked her and she said. She said yeah, I did.
Speaker 1:But if you don't know, you just need. I asked the same question. Your mind fills in the blanks.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I asked the same question, you know, and we're building even more memories now, but that was one of the first ones that like really humbled me and floored me. You know, I wish I was better, I would journal I'm not good at that stuff.
Speaker 1:Yeah, me either. And I'm like, oh, my goodness, and I know that my mom remembered my birthday was like you did. I asked and she said yes, and so I think the running joke with my siblings are now like she changed her password to my birthday so they couldn't get in. Well, you know they, they knew that it was changed, you know, because I think it, because my brother was like the golden boy, so everything was my brother, my brother, my brother, and. But when I came on the scene, she changed the password to my birthday and and I changed my password to her her her birthday too. Oh, how sweet. Yes, yes.
Speaker 1:And one of the most memorable things I just thought about with with my mom was you know, she, you know, she said she didn't have a lot, and I'm like, well, I don't have nothing either. So, we good, we good. She said you know, I don't have anything. But I remember her actually giving me two things. One was we took a trip to DC and during that trip we went to the wax museum and people who know me know I love Whitney Houston. So I took a picture with Whitney Houston's wax figure and on my birthday she framed it. She framed it for me and sent it to me as a gift. I was so touched. That's the first thing she's ever given me.
Speaker 2:And the fact that you loved Whitney Houston as you do. Yes, that was huge, that was.
Speaker 1:That was huge.
Speaker 2:That was.
Speaker 1:And then the last thing that she gave me before her passing was a necklace with my initial and my birthstone in it. Awesome, but the Whitney Houston. I love the necklace, but the Whitney Houston was the one that it's the little things. It's the little things you know. I didn't even expect for her to do that, but she thought of me that much to do that, so that was really touching to me.
Speaker 2:So, as we're reflecting about our memories from Mother's and Mother's Day and First Mothers and first mothers and second mothers, I want to take a moment to just encourage everybody to one be mindful that tomorrow is not promised, you know, don't put off till tomorrow what you can do today to tomorrow. What you can do today, if you have any opportunity for reconciliation or to share or connect, try Now. There are scenarios and situations that are beyond your control. I'm not saying to move heaven and earth, to do something that's impossible, but I think that, being on the other side, we always say the hindsight is 20-20.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Being on this side. You know we wish that we could. You know, there will be potentially a day where you're going to say, man, I wish I could have that meal one more time.
Speaker 2:I wish I could you know, have that conversation or, you know, go and see. Those are gifts that I think sometimes we take for granted in the routines of life. Yeah, because we feel like, oh, I ain't got to worry about that, we put it to the side. I just want to really encourage, especially this week, to reflect on where you're at. I'm not going to make it a religious thing, because I don't know what your choice is, but I believe that everything happens for a reason. I just think that sometimes we don't take the time to recognize what the reason is or even accept it, because we want to put our own spin on it and our own reasoning and selfishness.
Speaker 2:Um, but it is a beautiful thing to have memories of a mother. Um, I know some people don't have positive memories, um, and what I would say is I encourage you to talk to somebody about it. Yeah, because it is. It's tough to kind of balance all your thoughts yourself. Yeah, you know I'm an advocate for counseling. I've had to go to counseling as a result of my adopted mom passing, because I just didn't know how to proceed. I felt like I was in slow motion and everybody in the world was going fast forward, so I needed to hit the reset button. Even with my first mom coming back in, I had to learn how to navigate that space.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:You know, like I said, I wanted everything to be fast and then I wanted everybody to look at the situation like I did. You know, I've been. It's like a slingshot. I've been waiting and I'm just ready to go. And even she had to remind me just be sober, just be natural. And then even with my daughters, they've seen the whole thing play out, so they are very much guarded and reserved, as well as my wife. The one thing that I think that our community does not do well is have discussions.
Speaker 1:Oh absolutely.
Speaker 2:Our communication, you know is, is lacking at times. So this week make a phone call. It might not be to your mom, but it might be to a mother figure, could be to an aunt. Yeah, reach out and just let somebody know the impact that they've had on you, because the old saying goes, you know, give people their flowers while they're here.
Speaker 2:So we want to give and acknowledge. That's what we wanted to do today Give flowers. I want to give you your flowers, like I tried to just communicate, like seeing you and the impact you've had on my family and my girls and then your kids or my girls. I appreciate it, I'm thankful for it. You know, and now understanding and knowing where it came from, two generations prior to yes, so thank you for that.
Speaker 1:Well, thank you for sharing your daughters with me.
Speaker 2:Not a problem. It takes a village, it takes a village.
Speaker 1:It takes a village, I know. I want to say that we appreciate our first mothers for bringing us into the world Absolutely and we appreciate our adoptive mothers for making us who we are today.
Speaker 2:Absolutely.
Speaker 1:We wouldn't be who we are without either one of them. We had to have both of them in our lives.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And that's important, because who knows who we would have been if we stayed with the first family? We just don't know. But like John said earlier, all things happen for a reason in a season. So this was our. Our path of where we went was destined for us to go in that direction.
Speaker 2:Absolutely.
Speaker 1:Would we have loved to be in our adoptive family. Who wouldn't? Right, but I wouldn't change nothing for the family that I was raised in. I wouldn't, I just wouldn't.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I agree. You know, my first mom has even said to me she was like her prayer was that I was taken care of and loved, and she was able to see that her prayer was answered. So you know what else can you really ask for. So you know what else can you really ask for.
Speaker 1:So and see, and this is why I didn't go to church on Mother's Day.
Speaker 2:I'm sorry, sorry for pulling the bandaid, but hopefully they are tears of joy and a safe space. And, yeah, the thing I will share, sometimes being transparent, it gives other people permission to be vulnerable. Here it is. We don't know where this will land and who will see it and why. So, hopefully, our reflections. We took a different turn than we normally do, but with Mother's Day coming up, we wanted to, like I said, just kind of share our hearts and give some flowers. Yes, there you go, thank you. So again, we want to say happy Mother's Day to all the mothers out there. All the mother figures me, mom, grandma, everybody. Mother's Day to all the mothers out there. All the mother figures me-moms, grandmas, aunties, everybody, thank you. Thank you for being a mother, for choosing to be a mother.
Speaker 1:Happy Mother's Day to all.
Speaker 2:I'm John.
Speaker 1:And I'm Lisa, and we are adopted.
Speaker 2:This was our Mother's Day episode.
Speaker 1:Until next time.
Speaker 2:Until the next episode. Thank you for listening to the so I'm Adopted podcast. We hope that this was informative and educational. You can follow us on Instagram and Facebook at so I'm Adopted. Also, subscribe to our YouTube channel so I'm Adopted. And again, thank you for listening and until next time, make the choice to begin your healing journey.
